Originally Posted by jwp475
Originally Posted by 458Win
There is no denying the fact that some of the older 458 Win ammo gave erratic performances due to a combination of age, compression and heat. But to be fair one must also realize that original Kynoch loads also fail to reach anywhere near their advertised velocities. Ross Seyfried tested original Kynoch 450/400 loads and was suprised when they barely reached 1900fps - but it still has a good reputation. Every original Kynoch load that I have ever tested, as well as those results published by a few astute Aftican gun loonies, give real world ballistics between 2000 to 2100fps (rather than the advertised 2300-2400fps) and this has been proven over and over to be all that is needed. Even Jack Lott was only looking to acheive these velocities.
With modern powders it is easy to duplicate - and surpass- these ballistics with the 458, with no compression or pressure problems.
If you want more velocity - for whatever reason - and can afford the price - then go ahead and buy a bigger round. But don't discout the experiences of Harry Selby ( when he traded in his 416 Rigby he bought a 458 Win ) , Don Heath, Charlie Haley, Richard Harlan or Finn Aagaard and expect me to believe the round is ineffective and can't safely reach 2100fps with 500 grain bullets.


Precisely.... [Linked Image] [Linked Image] [Linked Image]

The Picture below is of a Bison that I took with a 500 Linebaugh with a 525 grain WFLN hard cast bullet at 1120 fps and the bullet went completely through and exited the animal.If the 500 grain out of the 458 only got 1900 fps nothing is going to walk away from that.....
[Linked Image]


JWP475,

Unfortunately, a .458", 500gr roundnose steel jacketed solid at 1900fps is not sufficient for reliable penetration on elephants. It is barely enough on Cape Buffalo which are in a different league bone structure wise than our American Bison. Effective, reliable performance of 500gr roundnose steel jacketed solids on elephants starts at about 2000fps, maybe 2025fps, and goes up from there.

I have killed elephants with .458" 500gr steel jacketed solids at 2050fps and at 2135fps, both work but the difference is pretty aparrent. There is only 85fps difference in the two loads, going to 1900fps is loosing 150fps from none to far from the minimum.

Interestingly, a flat nose .458" mono copper solid at 2190fps will outpenetrate the heavier solid by a huge margin.

For the elephant, the bullet must often travel three feet or more through very thick, tough skin and then sinew, muscle, solid bone, liquid filled honey comb and finally a last thin shell before reaching the brain. Might have to deal with tusk sockets and tusks too depending on the angle. On top of that, it is good insurance to be shooting a load that will still have the energy to break the spine if the brain is missed low or enough energy to concuss the ele to knock it down, especially if it is trying to kill you.

JPK