Limiting shots to 300 yards and under what bullet would you use? Any success stories or pics would be great.

Have killed a number of elk with a 100 gr. Hornady interlock, and a couple with a 100 gr. Nosler Partition.

100gr partition was first on my list

Yep. Mine too.

Have used both 100 gr. Partitions and 95 gr. BT with good results.

Partition would be the answer to what you asked.

My suggestion is to use more power than the 243. The cow elk deserves it.

Over the years, I have seen more than a few Elk killed with a .243 Bulls and Cows, a well placed shot with a .243 will kill any Elk on the Planet, 100 gr Partition or my favorite 105 gr. Scenar out of a .243 A.I. will do the job. Rio7

Mousegunners Unite!

.243 Win not much of a prime choice for an elk rifle...... Better grab a 6mm or 6.5 man bun.

My daughter killed her first three with 85 gr barnes. None took more than one shot.

I killed my first elk with a 243 win and 100gr Winchester power points. I have two 243’s now, one I load with 85gr TSXs and the other 95 gr nosler ballistic tips. Neither one would be my first choice for elk, but I wouldn’t pass up an opportunity if one presented itself. Just like everything else, shot placement is key.

My Wife had taken about ten cow elk with her Browning BLR in .243, She bought that rifle with her summer peach picking money when she was 15. I tried to buy her a more appropriate elk caliber and got told where to get off.

Killed a 5 pt. bull with 85 gr. Partitions. As had been said "placement matters".

A well placed shot (between the eyes) with a .22 long rifle will kill any elk on the planet. However, not all shots are well placed. I’d use a bigger gun.

Don't you know that shot placement doesn't matter if your using a caliber bigger than a 243 ?
A 243 using heavy jacketed projectile's is more than adequate for harvesting any sized elk in your range requirement.
Push it to 301 yards and all bets are off.

This old vid has made the rounds but if you haven’t watched it give it a looksee.

John Burns, Has a You Tube video of a girl killing a adult cow Elk at about 600 yards, dropped at the shot, there's no flies on the .243.



10 rnds at 1000 yards with a 107 Gr. Smk .243

Partition will handle it, again shot placement

Beat me to it I was looking for John's Video. Rio7

The 243 Win can sure get it done, but in all honesty it would not be considered the best choice. Understand for youngster’s benefit and others wanting light recoiling chambering it is considered satisfactory.

On the video and other opinions who have used it on elk with success, great. Would love to see video (fat chance) and opinions whereby it wasn’t particularly effective or successful in one or two shots or even recovery of elk. I know those scenarios are out there, but I won’t my breath waiting for any disclosure.

Of course there are elk shot with a .243 that weren’t recovered.

Just like there are elk that were shot and not recovered with a .338, /06, .270 etc. Your point?

You know what can be learned from those scenarios?

To blame yourself.

It's a dead elk for sure, but it's pretty clear it was hit quite far back in the butt or spine. Not exactly great shooting, but it got the job done that day (we all have off days and sometimes get a gift). Of course none of that is to say the 243 won't work on elk - it obviously will. I'd just not use that video as some sort of 6mm/elk testimonial. Quite the opposite, I'd say it's a bit of an indictment of shooting at 688 yards in wind by what appears to be a relatively inexperienced shooter.

If I was going to use my 243, I would use an 80 grain Barns or 100 grain partition

I talked to a guy who could not pull back his bow much so he went to 43 lbs. The arrow went right through it. Not sure if it was a cow or bull though.

Me thinks all this .243 Win bulls hit is trolling for a good old fashioned Campfire pizzin contest! 😂

No just trying to see if the ones who’ve done it prefer lower weight monos at higher velocity or older school design like the 100gr partition

Why not just use monos in a 223 or 5.56 if your bent on using light tackle on elk? After all with good placement it should take out an cow elk at 9000 yds.

BTDT, either/or will work well.

I haven’t looked, but can a person buy OTC non resident elk tags in Montana?

This conversation has taken place MANY times on this forum, and the answer is the same every time: actual experience says yes, the .243 is enough for elk with the right bullets, but you may be more comfortable using a larger diameter/heavier bullet on your hunt.

Here is the comment I posted in 2007 about the same subject:

I've talked/emailed with 2 long-time elk guides who recommend the .243. I have a friend who has downed 14 of the critters with his Sako .243, and Grits Gresham once wrote an article (I have a copy of it) about the many times he hunted with Whiskey Chamberland, an Idaho elk guide who claimed 15 one-shot kills with the .243.

They all say pretty much the same thing: stay within 300 yards, know exactly where your bullet is going (easy with the mild recoil of the .243), be patient so you can put the bullet into the lungs and you've got a dead elk.

Bullets recommended range from 70 gr spitzer at 3400 fps+ to 85 grain Barnes TSX to 85 gr Sierra hollowpoint boattail to 100 gr Core-Lokt (today, I would add the 95gr Nosler Ballistic Tip and the 100gr Nosler Partition).

If all I had was a 243, I wouldn't hesitate to go elk hunting. But I think Ty Herring from Barnes Bullets put it best when he emailed me, "A 243 will do the trick, but a larger caliber would be better for elk."

I found a .22 slug embedded under the skin and above the eyes on a good sized bull. I doubt it even pissed him off. Also, the elk brain is halfway between the earbutts and the antler bases, considerably behind the eyes.

Based on the trace, it looks to me like the bullet impacted high, just behind the front leg (shoulder blade/spine shot).

If that was the case, typically it would have dropped at the front end first. It didn't, it dropped butt first, then at the front indicating a rear shot, probably high in the rear spine.

And the wind was blowing right to left.

The whole thing is pretty irresponsible.

I'm not sure I'd agree. The trace is quite clear in that video. I've seen lots of animals shot in the scapula/spine drop their rear end first. Neurologically, this is a reasonable reaction if the CNS is disrupted behind the front shoulders.

The wind was fairly calm and constant, judging by the slow drift of the elk's breath. I would guess about 2-3 mph FV at the elk's location, which would only drift the bullet about 7" or less if they are above 3000 feet ASL. Of course it's nearly impossible for me to accurately judge the wind from shooter to target based on the video alone, but the sort of wind seen in the video is usually fairly easy to judge and shoot in.

Nonsense, if you place the bullet properly. Cow elk are no bigger than many caribou, and they all fell down.

So did the 1300lb moose my wife shot.

A badly placed .338WM bullet may be - may be - marginally more effective than a 100 gr. .243 bullet, but I wouldn't put money on it.

Either will get the job done if well placed at reasonable range. At "unreasonable range - :)" I'd go with the larger.

I've had and used a 243 for decades. It's worked well.

Never much cared for it tho. But that's personal, not objective.

Keep those .243 stories coming! ROTFLMAO 🤣 🤣🤣🤣

Please explain. That sounds interesting.

I know this is an elk forum and I'm not trying to highjack. I mostly hunt deer in coastal Carolina. They are small. I've killed deer with my 243 but don't like that it doesn't give me a blood trail. Before everyone chimes in on my "abilities", shot placement was never the issue. Center punch the lungs above the heart and the deer generally go 20-40yds (my experience with factory ammo). Coastal Carolina has some badass bush and without blood on the ground sometimes you almost have to trip over the animal to find it. I believe in complete pass through, 2 holes let in more air and let out more blood. I'm just getting going with reloading, what bullet will give me the blood trail I want? (I currently have 100gr boat tail Interlocks and 100gr partitions)

Again, not trying to highjack, this seems like the right "cast of characters" to answer the question.

In a persons hand the .243 looks so innocent & harmless until one shoots something and then a person wakes up to the reality that we might be shooting more gun than we need most of the time. Those little 80-85gr TTSX/TSX or 95/100 NP are pretty wicked little killers.

I’ve only shot a few deer & several hogs with the .243/6mm but I really can’t see why they wouldn’t work. The wounds on those animals has always been more than enough and sometimes far more violent than one would think.

As always, making a good shot is the most important consideration.

I’ve shot the 243 a lot, but I was pretty conservative on my reloading and I know I haven’t used it to it’s full potential. It’s got it’s faults and I would like to transition to the 6 creedmoor as I have plenty of components. I wouldn’t be afraid to hunt elk with either one.

A .243 is a 6mm, a 6mm creed, is between a .243 and a .243 A.I. pretty much the same thing, or same-o same-o, you won't change much but the name, if it feels good do it. Rio7

What I’m most concerned about is throat erosion in the 243 with the shallow shoulder angle. I know it’s not efficient to use a 243 for prairie dogs... but it sure is fun.

I have a "sort of" .243/cow elk experience. Back in May of 2001, I was recovering from a neck fusion surgery I had done in late 2000. I had read a story by Mike Venturino (sp?) about the the wildcat 6x47mm ( 222 Mag/6mm) He touted it as a very good combo coyote/deer round. I was "only allowed" by the surgeon to shoot non-recoiling firearms ( his words, said in front of my wife! uh oh! ha) so I had a muzzlebrake put on an existing 220 Swift and used it successfully on mule deer & exotics. (Prior to this hunt) I then had a Model 700 SA made up with a 27 inch barrel in 6x47mm. I shot the Barnes 85 XBT aa solid 2900fps ( short barrel 243 speeds easily) I killed an Axis doe, a big Axis buck and then I had an opportunity I couldn't pass up. I made a trade with the Rancher for another rifle I had and some money for a Scimitar Horned Oryx. The outfitter was a little nervous about my light rifle, but we had hunted many times together and he knew I would wait on the right shot. We got a bull and a few cows, and could not get closer than 184yds ( lasered range finder) I was on my knees (grass a bit high) held the rifle against a sapling and I shot the bull at the base of the neck. He dropped straight down. I walked up and from 75yds I gave him an insurance shot ( on his side, his chest was facing me and I out one it in. He was already dead, but get this.,. The neck shot was a complete pass through and the 2nd shot penetrated and broke/stopped in the backbone! It weight 83gr if I remember right, ha. This was a big oryx, and though we guesstimated "500 pds" he was most like closer to 375 or a tad more. Cow elk sized. A fluke? No, I "intentionally" shot the thing "on purpose", ha. It was "the only rifle I had, at that time, that I was allowed to use, and it was either that or stay home! I enjoyed the experience, I love to tell that story, ha, but I really do like to use a bigger rifle on elk. I've only killed 4 cow elk (no bulls at all!) smallest round was a 30-06, largest a .375 H&H! But man is it fun! To each his own Pard, if "you" know you can shoot it, go for it!

A Hornady Interlock tight behind the front leg will do all you ever need on any deer, or most else you may hunt.

This is a management Bull killed by a disabled vet, just before Christmas last year, 1 shot DRT, .243 100 Gr. Factory Blue box. Rio7

Add to the above post, this was a spot and stalk hunt, took about 2 hours to get a shot off sticks standing at 227 yards, This Bull dropped like a wet rag. Rio7

Hornady Interlock.
Good bullets.

I think .24 cal is the legal minimum in CO.

Never hunted with a 243win. I had one once. It was a target rifle. One of the most accurate I ever had.

I wouldn't discouraged its use if a hunter desired it.

CO minimum for elk is 24 caliber and bullet weight min is 85gr.

Elk Country

Hunting elk in western Montana this days, a guy should take into consideration grizzly bears.

Hunted cow elk in central Montana last two years. No grizz in area. Last fall a hunter shot a cow at about 200 yards with a .243 using 100 grain Hornady bullets. Shot twice but probably did not need to shoot second time since both shots were in same place. Animal fell near shot impact. Another hunter was using a .375 H&H with TTSX bullets. Shot six times, hitting animal 5 times at about 100 yards with animal standing and not running. Animal finally fell over after last shot and all shots should have been lethal within a few inches of each other. Bullet selection and shot placement is probably more important than caliber, based on this example of one.

Cool stuff Rio. Good to see you taking care of them Vets!

What is a “management bull”? You on a high fence operation?

WAM, A management Bull is a bull that has not reached his potential for his age, yes these Elk are in a 20000 acre high fence pasture, We have our guest disabled vets take them if we can find them, Now tell me what you are doing to help our disabled vets? and improve the hunting where you are ??? Rio7

Alright fellas, no need for pizzin match.

Just stories and theories 😂 on using the 243.

Over penetrated pass through lung shots leave a lot to be desired for quick kills, especially at shorter ranges. Barnes monos will do that. Outcome would have seen different results if the shoulder was taken with a couple shots. Age old argument regarding penetration vs expansion. Barnes bullets are great on bones and muscle, not as good on soft tissue as others. If you’re shooting lungs the Hornady SST is literally the bomb.

I am pretty sure that WAM is a disabled vet, as am I.

Anyhow I always thought a "management" bull was one that may or may not have reached it's full potential for age, but either way due to (usually) poor genetics they would never have real desirable antlers, regardless of age. As a result they are culled to get their genetics out of the gene pool and usually at a steep discount. Am I wrong about that? Plenty of people weed them out on public land too if they can't find the big trophy they're after. Whether that "improves" the hunting is debatable, depending on what the management goals are.

Anyways to the OP: I cna't say anything more about the .243 Win and elk than what has already been said. It is fine with most any bullet designed for hunting. I'd avoid FMJs and varmint bullets, but that's about it.

T Inman, We have always felt the disabled vets and their family's, cannot be thanked enough for what they have suffered to make this a safe place for all of us, and I THANK YOU for your service.

As for Management Bull Elk, we are on the same page, we give ours to vet's, as most of them will never get a chance or be able to do a Rocky Mountain hunt, we have put a lot of effort into making this a disabled friendly ranch, Rio7

That’s cool [bleep]. Another disabled Vet here as well, although there are many worse than I.

Not to kick off on a tangent but the hunting and outdoors opportunities for some disabled vets has been a true lifesaver, literally.

Ri
Rio7,
Thank you ever so much for your service and generosity toward our veterans. God bless you and others who do likewise.

I was not pizzing about your management bull nor your fences. Just merely asking about the term used, as in my ignorance I had only heard it used in reference to deer culling. As T Inman said, I’m a 100% disabled vet myself but I manage to hunt on my own thankfully. I guess I should be doing more for more disabled vets than myself.

Happy Trails

WAM, I am sorry I came back so sharply, in the past we have heard a lot of crap about hunting on a high fence ranch, from the holier than hell couch hunters, that think we are shooting critters in pens, i can assure you on this ranch that is not true. over the years we have made some great friends with our vets, and have enjoyed seeing their lives improve from year to year. hunting and fishing is great moral and confidence builder for our vets and they love getting together and shooting and hunting and eating, B.S.ing, with each other, it's a pleasure for us to make this happen. THANK YOU !! Rio7

95gr Horn SST - only caveat, stay off bone, other than ribs.

It'll normally paint your back drop red !

YES !

beretzs, Many vets have told me hunting and fishing has saved their lives, depression takes a terrible toll on our vets, the outdoor activities perks them up and gives them something to look forward to. look up The Healing Waters Project, they are in all 50 states, they started out as a fly fishing group teaching vets to cast a fly on the grass at Bethesda, in D.C. Now they are teaching fly tying and rod building, and taking vets fishing and hunting, we have been a part of Healing Waters, 15 years. and have had 400 disabled vets as our guests. THANK YOU !! Rio7

Great stuff. Thank you

Rio7,
All good here!
Happy Trails

Not a damn thing wrong with that. Good on ya.

Dbl post.

Good stuff!

Thanks to all you vets.

Speculation. I try not to do research in this area.

But I see I could have made my post clearer. I was speculatively comparing calibers with the SAME bad placement. Not a badly placed .338 vs a well placed .243.

Sorry about that.

Ah. Thanks for the clarification.

Shot my first elk with a 250 Savage and a 87 grain something bullet. A 243 will work fine with a 100 grain Partition, have done it.

.243 wouldn’t be my first choice for an elk rifle, but if that’s what I had I certainly wouldn’t stay home. I’d load up some TTSX’s, or 100gr Partitions or Interlocks and go hunting.

Well said.

I've killed cow Elk using my .257 Roberts, wasn't hunting (moving cattle), wouldn't have been my first choice, but the 115 gr Nosler partition had no issues whatsoever.

Respects,
Richard

My wife killed her first elk at a naive 24 years old with a borrowed .243 Win. She will readily admit that it was a lucky shot.....the kill actually required two shots! She will be the first to tell you that’s it’s not a great elk cartridge!

She’s many killed elk since, with the vast majority being one-shot kills after going up a few calibers in cartridge selection! memtb

I have seen it done a few times but never shot an elk myself with a 243. In 50+ years of elk hunting and guiding I have come to think of the 243 about like every other person who's seen them used a lot.

Bullet holes kill, not guns or bullets. Those are tools to make the hole. Holes can vary in 3 ways. Diameter, depth and straightness.

The 243 shows excellent results when used with excellent bullets and mediocre results when used with mediocre bullets. It can give poor results when used with poor bullets.

JUST LIKE MOST OTHER CARTRIDGES!


But when used with Barnes TSX, Nosler Partitions bullets, Hornady GMX, Swift bullets and many of the best bonded bullets the 243 kills elk just fine. Maybe not as dramatic as the same placement with a 30-06 or 300 mag, but the elk die quickly enough when the bullet hole goes through what it should and a good 243 bullet will do just that.
I prefer larger and heavier bullets, but there is no arguing with success, and I have seen good kills many times from 243s.

100 gr (I think maybe Partition - if not that then a Corelokt) kilt a moose just fine for my wife.

Double-lunged at @ 75 yards, he walked about 30 feet to put a screen of willows between us, stood there for 20 seconds or so and tipped over. Missed ribs on both sides, so penciled through, but the lungs were mush.

I've never warmed to the .243, but have taken a bit of game with it (sheep, caribou, black bear, and that moose). I finally got my 700 to shoot about MOA, after 45 years of 2 1/2 MOA! (needs just the right amount of front tip pressure. .I should take it hunting again.....

What szihn said.

Regardless of slug, location/placement is everything.

Same w the 95 grain Partition.

Bone is no issue though and I normally try to break 1 or both shoulders. Break shoulders and you will be following short blood trails or deer are DRT.

Noted how many caveats, etc. are used when using light caliber cartridges for elk…..

yeh right

243 and elk should never be mentioned in the same sentence.

Only a moron does it.

If you can afford an elk license......you can afford an elk cartridge.

You 243ers are all stupid, beyond belief..... and deserve a head knocking.......badly!

I’ll be sure and relay that to the multiple elk that will fall to a .243 this fall.

I’ll show the kids this while their standing over their dead cow, they’ll get a good giggle out of it.

Only a remedial moron allows his kids to pursue elk with a 243......legal or not.

Get a full-time job, sell Avon on the side, use coupons at the grocery store........and then go buy an elk rifle.

I own 243’s.....and even a ratty ol’ 788 6mm. They work fine for prairie dogs, jackrabbits......right on up to the heavy stuff....coyotes.

Mike, why don’t you get back to worrying about the record whitetail, and leave killing elk with a .243 to those who know how to get it done without drama.

Says the guy who lives in a state where hunting big game with a rifle isn't even legal....TFF

Oh...

Rifles have been allowed during the late doe seasons....in some counties.......but don’t let any facts stand in your way.

Certain straight-walled cartridges are also legal in rifles......State-wide.....both gun seasons.

You must be a high school graduate.......from a public school.

I know a lady who shoots all her elk with a .243 Win. All monster bulls by the way. She is a rancher in good elk country and is one of those few who can pick her shots or hunt another day as Boddington keeps writing about. There was one epic failure that almost ended her husband existents when the shot placement or the bullet was bad. She knocked it down and all thinking it was dead her husband went up to the bull. The bull got up and charged her husband at close range. Luckily he was able to get a shot into its head before it could do the damage it was set on. No idea what caliber he used.

In Iowa.....have legally taken many deer with .270, 30-06, .450BM.

But, never a .243.

TFF!

LOL

The short version is, you have a really small window of experience.

Keep playing the fool, and we’ll continue laughing at you.

Maybe so, but I've killed more elk than you've ever seen.....TFF

It's like you're in a contest with yourself to see if you can out-@zzhole previous posts.

It would be silly to say that a .243 with proper bullets at responsible ranges can't get the job done. I wouldn't use it nor would I recommend it to anyone, however. Especially if I was a non-resident hunter that paid a lot of money for the privilege of hunting elk in another state.

Anyone who thinks you can't kill an elk cleanly with a 243 and the right bullet (or a 22-250 for that matter), hasn't hung around old timers in Idaho, Montana or Alaska much.

I think it's funny when a guy from Iowa is telling scenarshooter how to hunt elk in Montana.

Hah, yet you pretend to opine authoritatively about how it works on big game.

Mike, I think it's good you know the limits of your ability, I don't think you should use the .243, for anything that you find to challenging, Bless Your Heart Rio7

Mike is reminding me how powerful a closely held personal belief can be.
I like to see how much I can learn rather than tell others what they should do, based on what I “know”.
Have a great hunt season!

Well, at least he's winning the contest.

To all the “I choose to shoot elk with a 243” crowd.......

You all know you’re the Ned Beatty of the canoe group.

And I’ve shot more head of big game than you could if you lived to be 250 years old.

Land owner=many tags.

And......all land purchased with hard earned monies.....no inherited land or funds.

You’re special, scenarshooter.......just like everyone else.

But, you’re not overly intelligent.

How did the wringing out of that Leupold go? You're the man!

TFF

LOL

This is priceless......

You send your kids out elk hunting with a 22-250?

Be a good Dad.......send 'em out with a .17.

Scenarshooter is low intelligence.....

Let the games begin.

You are remedial. Enjoy it best you can, your options are limited.

Internet bullies.........it’s what’s for breakfast.

Mike, I wish you could see that you're the bully, in almost every "conversation" you're part of. Get help dude.

Where is that genius.......scenarshooter?

Bully? I don't hide my name or location.

This estrogen-laden thread just got a testosterone shot........that's all.

You're having a meltdown over people having actual experience with a .243 on elk. I don't think that'll cause the testosterone shot you seem to think it will.

Providing your name and location doesn't mean you're not a bully.

Wow, I guess some of the elk we have killed over the last few years and eaten we’re not really dead. 3 with 243 equivalent cartridges, 1 with a smaller cartridge (6.8 spc). All shot through the shoulder, all but one fell on the spot. The one that didn’t, didn’t make it past 25 yards. We have killed several in the same timeframe with larger cartridges as well, but the end result was the same.

chico, you must be remedial too! lol

Meltdown? Seriously?

Take the others from parent case......260, 7-08, 308(parent). More mass=better........on bigger mass animals.

Really don't have time to teach 'moment of inertia'........scenarshooter wouldn't understand it anyway.

@geniusfromIowa,

Moment of inertia has nothing to do with bullets.

Nice swing and a miss.

Ask for a refund on your diploma.

Little wonder you're a scenarshooter fanboy.

Were you born in California, by chance?

Well this turned into a [bleep] show.

A 243 elk thread should be.......

Anxiously awaiting any sort of challenge from scenarshooter.........IQ or physical.

Double or nothing, even.

Mike, do you have a twin brother living in Alaska?

Where is the expert, scenarshooter?

I can leave this evening.

Stick has little tolerance for expert pretenders.

Hint!

Well, of course it should be when the guy with the strongest opinion has never seen an elk shot with a .243.

That's the definition of a sh*t show. Because opinions are like *ssholes.

Sh*tty, ain't it?

And you're the best the Colorado school system has to offer?

What did you shoot that last little cow with, 'pole?

Scenarshooter idiotically declared Iowa never had a rifle season for big game.

Where is the brainless simpleton?

Anxiously awaiting a challenge!

The new F150 gets over 21 mpg(5.0). Can leave this evening.

Looks like Mikey is having a melt down in moms basement.

When you have to stoop to shining shoes.......look me up.

I tip well.

Mikey, be careful wish for, would be a shame to put all those miles on your new f-150 just to get your ass whipped.

Rio7

I'm wondering what MIKEWERNER thinks about shooting big game with match bullets?

For the record........please post where I declared never using a 243 on big game.

Between shifts at McDonald's.

TFF

LOL

Yea.......that would be a real shame.

Me thinks you and Jethro Bodine have a lot in common.

Didn't know Iowa had any "big game"!

All those big bucks likely migrated from Missouri.....

Satisfied?

Hardly big.

What's a "big" buck, 300#?

LOL, that's right Granny, fix me a samwich!

The 190 inch bowkill was 275 (not dressed) on the scale.

Close enough?

Mikey, I know it’s asking a lot, but try to keep up. The conversation is about elk being killed with a .243.

I'll try to keep up with an intellectual giant like you.

I like a semi-gloss finish on my shoes........just to screw with the matte finish scopes.

I’d be a bit grouchy too if I had to drive the wife’s grocery getter.

No tip for you.......243 elk gimper.

Where is the expert..........scenarshooter?

Patiently waiting.

Is the lil' fella at a Holiday Inn Express?

I’m saying that a cow elk packing a 243 would be a pretty formidable creature!!

Are you at the Holliday Inn Express.......with scenarshooter?

Watching "Frozen"?

Just saying my wife shoots a 243 and she’s shot several mule deer at three hundred yards. So a cow elk should be able to shoot a hundred yards wouldn’t you think?? 😀😀😀😀

Your logic is as sound as scenarshooter's.

He is 'wringing out' that new Leupold, you know.

your getting a little over your head speaking of moment of inertia.

" tendency or measure of tendency to produce motion especially about a point or axis"

momentum is mass times velocity which applies to ballistics. As opposed to moment of inertia which does not..

Congrats.....you graduated third grade.....maybe......with a little help/cheating.

You're a friggin' genius.

Quit Burger King........you're too good for them.

The Yankees have been extra volatile recently....

Just an observation...

When your roof sprinklers go down.......you'll be there too.

Emotional maturity goes a long way in life...

Don't be so hard on yourself.......some men just naturally have higher levels of estrogen.

Werner
Never saw anyone make a bigger fool of themselves here, than you have.

Am right behind all those 243 expert elk shooters........your pathetic grammar aside.

It would be “ I am” genius.

I’d explain it better but I don’t have enough time or crayons.

I prefer a semi-gloss brown......but you're the shoe-shine expert.

You can go matte.......if you insist on going with the current trends.

Will always side with "my people".

Kinda like Trump that way........

It doesn't take a genius to read between the lines...

Stick around, he's going for a personal best tonight.

That would read.......IN IOWA.

You're even more remedial than originally reported.

Start flipping burgers........the fry grease fumes are messing up your already disadvantaged gourd.

scenarshooter has a good one in you!

Good job!

One thing is for sure: you certainly don't understand it. Or perhaps you could enlighten us about calculating the second-ranked moment of inertia tensor, and how it pertains to the principal axes. No Google or Wiki allowed, LOL. Hint: it is certainly related to bullets. Double Hint: it has nothing to do with the terminal performance difference between a .243 and a .308.

Though that attempt at "momentum" and "inertia", concatenated, was hilarious!

If by "remedial" you mean that I'm here to remedy your ignorance, then right you are.

How about this: exactly how many head of big game (deer or larger) have you killed with a .243?

Wow.....you are truly a Canadian.

Please tell us all.......shooting at extremely long range...........which direction is most advantageous........and why?

Look on the internet......the problem is.......you will never understand it.......even when you read it.

Show us your intelligence........

Make scenarshooter proud.

Waiting........

Flip that burger and enlighten us all, remedial Jordan Smith.

Make scenarshooter proud.

Just how long does Google take?

Where is Jordan?

OK.............remedial Jordan.

The circumference of the earth at the equator is around 24,900 miles.

Given full rotation at 24 hours (the sun isn't moving, moron)..........the earth is rotating over 1000 miles per hour at the equator.

Your biggest disadvantage at long range(no wind).........is shooting north and south.

East and west minimizes the earth's rotation on your bullets path.

None of you are particularly bright.

Lesson #2 tomorrow, geniuses.

WOW. LOL.

Well, you’ve been entertaining tonight, but I’ve wasted enough time. Keep on dodging questions and killing those BG animals with your .243! Oh wait, you never have and never will. Have a good night!

Go back to third grade........you'll get it the second time.

Study harder....

He is too smart to waste his time with you, IQ or Physically.

Post up half the pictures of Scenarshooter, we'll all wait!

If I posted up half the pictures of scenarshooter.......that would make me a fanboy, like you.

Pretty easy to just put the guy on ignore.

Exactly......instead of huddling around a supposed 'expert'.....like a bunch of Muskox.

I don't think you appreciate how you tipped your hand when you inadvertently revealed your ignorance re momentum vs moment of inertia.

mathman.............can you even remotely see where MOMENT of INERTIA applies to the planet example listed earlier?????

With a lack of masses attracting (gravity).........and the established 1000+mph at the equator.......wouldn't you spin/launch right off the planet?

Please tell us all, mathman. How much does this spin (at equator) negate the attractive force of gravity.......as compared to the north pole?

Feel free to show your work.

We'll build on this......

Grammatically speaking, what's that string of periods called and why is it used?

Bluster and deflection won't work Mike.

You blew it when you dropped a technical term you really didn't understand in an attempt to insult someone else's intelligence.

Go earn an MS in Physics and/or a PhD in Math and then come back and school Jordan and me.

They represent a pause.......giving the genius brains a chance to catch up........rusty gears, tight bike helmets, and all that.

Show us all, please........more is coming.

Are you actually saying MOI does not apply to the example?

Do you agree with the bullet drift example.....from planet rotation?

Look forward to the exchange.

Mike, if you're as smart as you think you are and everyone else on here is as stupid as you say they are, why is it that you're the only one on here who apparently doesn't know you're not getting in your truck and driving to Montana?

Never claimed too be smart.......but can lay a legitimate claim you are stupid.

You got it half right, again.



Anyone caught allowing their kids to use a 243 on elk should be required to undergo more therapy.

Wow, Werner has successfully "out-dumbassed" everyone on this whole board. I didn't think a bar set so high was attainable, but Werner proved me wrong.

Thank you. It's not the first time Werner proved you wrong.

Do you shoot elk with a 243?

Do you have any larger caliber rifles?

Mike, have you ever seen an elk shot with a .243? Serious question.

Serious question.......what did you use for that last cow?

Mikey, have you ever seen an elk killed?

You are the king of dodge and deflect.

What caliber did you use....on your last elk?

Why not just answer?

Why dodge.......was it not a 243?

.50, you?

Great question.

Last elk was a cow......December 26th, 2020.......Cow Creek, off Esterbrook Road. Wyoming zone 7.

.270......150 bondeds.

Solo trip.....4 trips packing out......only 1.9 miles back, but some heavy snow.

Prefer 7mm's and 30's.........even .338.

Nice try Mike. It doesn't matter what I used to kill an elk, because I'm not the one commenting on the .243 as an elk round.

You on the other hand have very strong opinions on it so I'm just trying to get at what your opinions are based on. Actual experience, or what you've read or heard from others?

Are you done editing it now?

Why not answer?

No.......can I add one more thing, Mr.friggin-edit-police?

Mikey, it’s pretty obvious you have zero experience with elk and the .243, so your best move now is admitting you’re talking out of your ass.

It’s ok, nobody is going to think you are dumber than they already do. You have nothing to lose at this point.

Yea.......zero experience with the 243.

Sure......

You should read some of these PM's.

Nice deflect again.

So how many elk have you seen shot with a .243?

Coffee's ready, watching the show, waiting for the girly pix to start.

How does SLM know he doesn't like sucking [email protected] he's never tried it?

Same dumb logic.

Friends don't let friends shoot elk with a 243.

I'll answer just as soon as you do, how about that?

No, it's not logic at all. If someone isn't homosexual, then they don't enjoy homosexual acts. It's an either you are or you aren't proposition.

The effectiveness of cartridges on big game animals is on a continuum, it's not an either/or question.

Surely you understand the concept of a continuum?

You are exactly right.....a good portion of 243 elk shooters are likely homosexual or bisexual.

Now we are getting somewhere.

Hint: JOKING

Mikey, It's easy to tell you are pissed, about this .243 and Elk, thing you have going on, but I think it would be a good idea to drop , calling .243 shooters QUEERS. that's going to far! Rio7

Come on, Man....seriously? This is pure entertainment.

Ain't mad......it's all good (on my end, anyway).

Just a twist of smokepoles words.

Use whatever you want. I own 243's.....and even an old 788 6mm.

Just never would consider them for elk, when I have too many adequate rifles to pick from.

The bullsheit alarm soundeth….

Please explain........before I adequately offend you.

4 trips to pack a cow elk out? No doubt you’re either a feeble old elderly person - or a total pussy.

At the time.......it felt like a little of both.

Got it all out, same day.

No frame pack that trip.

Just got out of covid quarantine on December 23rd. Celebrated Christmas early.....left on the 24th.

Full recovered, or so I thought, when hopping in the truck.

Well? What do you doubt?

Expose your stupidity.

Dammit, I was saving that for later.

Anyone want to PM their email address?

Can send pics........butchering included.

Some of you may actually learn something.

Feel free to post them........to your hearts content.

Anyone?

We rode horses and mules, got close to the elk.

Cows, 243 with 100g partitions, max load of IMR 4350.

Learn the elk anatomy, place your shot, they flop or go no further than 40 yards. Massive internal damage on the cow elk which normally weigh between 450-550 lbs.

We boned off a lot of meat off the neck, and did not like that shot. We butchered them on the spot, packed out the meat in Panyards with the mules carrying the load.

To me, elk are easier to kill than a white tail buck in the rut.

My worst experience with recovering elk has been with a bow and a 50 cal muzzle loader. Lots of folks liked for me and my mules to come along on the hunt to pack out the animals. I generally stayed in camp till someone had an animal down as I was not providing them with animals to ride. Mules liked to get away from home, and so did I. So, we had a lot of hunts. I laid down some ground rules, I had the say on whether or not my mules were going to chase after a bad shot as they usually run down in some of the worst canyons you can imagine. All of the people I agreed to help, also got to go to the rifle range and shoot their rifles, part of the deal in me helping. Those that had no time to practice, did not get Blue, Maude, Buck, Bob's help on carrying out the meat. One crazy azz showed up with 55g Remington Accelerators to sight in his 30/06, I was ungodly pissed at him. I took him to Wal Mart and demanded that he buy 5 boxes of 180g Remington Core locts, and he did. He did get a trophy bull after practicing with his 7400 that he had only shot one time previously. One crazy Dr. shot a 7x7 in the azz with his 300 Weatherby. The bull ran down in a very steep canyon, and I refused to go down and chase the animal. Other party members went with them and I let them borrow my custom knives made by Dave McCrosky, city slickers did not have anything but a small pocket knife between them...they thought that I was an unpaid "skinner" and "packer". They were not happy that they were going to have to get their hands dirty. I had made an exception with the Dr not going to the range shooting his rifle. Later on, I told him what a mistake that had been, with my promise that I would only help if he and all his party went to the rifle range several times shooting their rifles. I never heard from any of them again...way to messy for them.

I have had several screaming confrontations with men that made bad shots on trophy. These men thought of nothing but their trophy, and they did not like me reminding them that I would not put my mules at risk in going down some of the very steep rocky canyons.. I got paid nothing for helping them, and they learned a HARD lesson on making bad shots. They had to quarter up the animal, bone out the meat, and get the meat to me and the mules as close as we could get.

Men have to learn that if they are going to shoot an animal as big as an Elk, that they must plan ahead on how they are going to get the animal out.

Two things come to mind before taking a shot:

A. do you have a clear shot-and good angle-Wind a factor?

B. if he does run, will you be able to get to him. In other words, know your terrain best you can.

I cut up one bull on the side of a steep mountain, and we pulled the quarters up the side of the mountain with a 300 ft rope being pulled by a Horse that I had trained for this task with Harness, This is a dangerous proposition, as a man has to come up with the bag of meat to keep it free from trees and stumps. Phones usually do not work in this kind of area so you are limited by walkie talkies with hit and miss reception. Pulling up the bag can actually entangle a man, snap a large limb bone quickly.

The worst night mares I have seen on wounded elk have been with big Weathby's and 338 WM where the owners never shot their rifles till they went hunting, never even verifying zero, and this kind of thing is prevalent in the hunting crowd....NO SCHITT!

Light caliber = close shots, and we were less than 150 yards with our 243's with very dead animals.

Elk seem to be getting tougher and harder to kill as people do not practice, verify zero, and want to kill them at greater distances. 270 Winchester with 150g Rem Core locts or Hornady 150g Interlock will get the job done in spades, same thing with 30/06 with 180's.

Nothing shocks me more than a guy that goes from year to year and never verifies the zero on his load or rifle. It is also surprising how many men just carry a pocket full of shells for their rifle, brand, grain weight, is just way over their head....dang!

I guess I resemble that remark. My young bull was probably average cow size and it took me 4 trips to get it out 20 years ago. I was only 36 at the time.

I think you should take up guiding fishermen or even golf.

Most all outfitters have enough of these stories to write a book.

I thought some experts here claimed the .22 bullet was the bomb for elk.

Been at the field autopsies of elk killed via 338, 06, 308, 7mm and the little 243. The 243 devastated the boiler room just like the rest.

Don’t confuse Mikey with facts.

MIKEWERNER - thank you for your valuable time and expertise on this very important subject.


NOT MUCH GOING ON IN LIFE FOR THIS GUY.

See if I got this right?

You claim to have superior intelligence, but you can’t figure out posting pics?

I have no desire to post pics.

scenarshooter craves praise.

We hunt for different reasons.

You have an email address? Ridicule them all you'd like.

It's just a big cow.

No Wyoming bull tag this year, either. Got cow tags, zone 7 type 6, once again.

Are you a private detective, by chance?

Great find!

You're on fire, today......Gumshoe.

Have we determined WAM was just regurgitating his breakfast.......with this post?

Surely it was a healthy meal.

Well, Pat is one of the most humble human beings on the planet.

So, again – your awareness sucks as bad as your disposition.

So.......he never posts his pics on the forums?

Go figure......

I had never thought about shooting an elk with a .243 til I read this thread. Based on my experience with the .243 and deer, I don't see why it couldn't work well. Almost every deer I've shot with one was wrecked pretty darn well.

The 243 Win gets a lot of use in the USA. It is a flat shooting hard hitter out to 300 yards. There are a large number in American households storing a 243 Win and it will perform on deer size game very effectively. Because it is readily used throughout the USA on deer it is logical to grab premium bullets and kill elk with it under favorable shot presentation, especially if you are recoil sensitive. Is it effective, yes but not the best choice on a 600-700 lbs animal. At least for me that’s how I see it.

Lets say your planning a plains game hunt in Africa, typically a one rifle affair. You’re looking to shoot gemsbok, zebra, wildebeest and sable. You show up with a 243 Win, what do you think your PH would say? Perhaps he’d say you are slightly undergunned for the task at hand, he’d probably suggest a bigger camp rifle and remind you that you’re going to pay regardless of recovering or not recovering the game you shoot. Would he be confident with your choice, would you be confident. Would you opt for a larger caliber or stick with your 243 Win? Possibly extreme example but elk are the same size and larger than some of the plains game mentioned.

To each his own.

I didn't say that. When he does, he's sharing with like-minded folks that generally enjoy seeing them – not to flex or one-up anyone.
But should someone need to be put in their hard-charging place, his Imgur account has more bullets in the chamber than any 5 people here combined.

We can all agree to disagree here but you're simply out-driving your headlights.

Reasonable assessment.

Denigrating SS's prowess and experience as a hunter defines ignorance and jealousy.

Congrats, you make bob brown appear less stupid.


mike r

Is SS.......salmonellashooter?

It's very difficult keeping all these great hunters apart.

You really should attend an AA meeting.

Ankle-biters Anonymous

Here's your sign..

You are one sharp cookie......Gumshoe.

Great job.

Do you use a 243 on elk?

My first rifle was a .243. Shot a pretty nice whitetail with it when I was a teen. I've used far inferior than a .243 on lots of elk.

Is that a yes.....or a no?

I have not used one, but had my butcher grinning at me with a bullet [pellet] he found in the shoulder of a big old ancient 7x7 NM bull i shot at 511 yards, took the pellet home and miked it, exactly .243 on the base, the little bullet gave all it had, but wasn't enough in this case.

I had my Sharps rifle on this hunt, the sun was setting in my right eye, i simply couldn't get rid of the glare to make the shot, i asked my guide for his rifle, a 7mm STW built by our old Buddy EddyBo, he also invited me along on that hunt, i spun a few mils and killed the bull with one shot, the 160gr Accubond numbed him up enough he did the chubby checker twist for 90 degrees and fell off in a rock ledge.

WTF do you care for? Original post was "Limiting shots to 300 yards and under what bullet would you use?"

Far more lethal combo above with a box of coreloc lead than anybody with a stick and string.

Get a life.

Reasonable experience and assessment...

Are you saying you have absolutely no experience......using a 243 on elk?

First dead bull elk I saw was taken with a single shot from a .243.

I have some experience on elk. How's the elk hunting in IOWA?

I'd be grumpy too i guess.

You have never shot an elk with a 243.......yet you're posting pro-243 in this thread?

You've taken elk.........but didn't chose the 243?

Sounds logical, Greenhorn. Smokepole would likely agree.

What would Mitch Rompala do?

Gunner, would you have stayed home from hunting elk if all you had was a 243 and a great shooting load?

And I will say I wouldn’t. I’d just pay more attention to what angle the old bulls standing at I guess.

No, i'd use my old load with the 100gr Partitions at 3000 fps and get as close as i could and try to get a shoulder on the way in or out, i would not have shot that old bull at 511 yards with the 243 Partiton load though, to far and too much wind for the little stubber of a bullet.

I knew your answer big buddy, before you typed it. Same thoughts here.

Old timers did it with atlatls, stick bows, muskets, etc. I’m pretty sure we could make do.

LOL, if not for the sun i'd have sent 500 grains of lead powered by Holy Black! ; ]

That would’ve been epic as hell Gunner.

One day.

You bet Buddy.

Do you enjoy the feeling of stepping on your dick?

Mikey, you’re as full of sheit as a barnyard turkey, just talking to hear your head roar. Happy Trails

In a perfect world there are many small caliber cartridges that will kill an elk. I will bet that even a 22 long rifle (undoubtedly the favorite of many here) will get the job done. If one has perfect conditions, presentation and the right shooter, its a slam dunk. But in reality that does not always happen and when it fails it's a lost animal. Many here have already posted that they have seen lots of elk lost too much larger and more powerful cartridges,. Thats true, but exponentially more elk hunters use a more powerful cartridge, hence lost game. Its' going to happen sooner or later. I have done it and so have my partners, but that still does not make the .243 a great elk cartridge. It's not, it is adequate in some instances but inadequate in far more. I once lost a deer shot at point blank range with a 45 caliber pistol, both shots hit well, but the buck managed to get up enough adrenaline and get away from me. Poor tracking conditions, hindered the recovery. If I had shot the same animal with my 45-70, (which I also had with me), it would have been DRT. I have a limited sampling of over 200 elk killed by myself and three others of my partners in 4 states and over 50 years. All with a 30;06 or greater. My best recollection is that 7 or 8 have been lost. Not because of bad shooting, but primarily because of conditions, which limited the retrieval.

Some of you guys must think hunting with arrows and roundballs is just completely moronic.

/greenhorn, having killed a couple of elk with traditional MZ, and several deer with a bow, I have yet to take a shot over 40 yards. An entirely different discussion.

Is it? If a guy knows when to not shoot? How is that an elk isn't something a .243 can't make good on every time with ease in the right hands? Bow hunters have to know they have a limit - so why is a .243 center fire a bad choice when 100% of bow hunters/blackpowder hunters are going out with a weapon FAR less effective?

I’ve hunted elk way more than most. Regardless of that, it does not take a rocket scientist to know that a .243 is absolutely lethal, more so than ANY arrow or roundball. Yet dumb fuchs will argue about calibers on the internet all day long.. and this guy from IOWA .. hilarious.

OK I read through 10 pages of this back and forth and I couldn't take it anymore. It reminded me of a tennis game going back and forth.. Only it ended up 1 against what, 10? I've never been elk hunting so I'm no expert. As far as I'm concerned if you can do it legally and ethically use a 17 Remington if you want. As for me, ifn I ever get a chance to go for an elk I'm probably going to use something bigger like my .270 or one of my .30-06s or maybe God forbid, my 7 Mag or my .300 WBY.. But I'm a neanderthal and I go by the theory that if little was equal to big they would have put .22s on battleships. But that's just me. I'm not getting into this pissing contest because I have never been elk hunting and though I think a .243 is a little on the light side, I can't in good faith argue with people who have been there-done that.

Shouldn’t be an issue, per the above parameters, and assuming you’re not a elk fevered mess behind the scope.

Mike loves to stir a big pot of shît.

Fun read....Thanks !

🦫

PS

SLM, might, allegedly, wear pink boots and a leopard thong under his Wranglers, but he can and does kill nice elk.

😝

Does WAM also have a Queer Alarm?

Someone should tell him to change his batteries.

There you go.........talking logically.

10 against 1 ain't hardly fair, is it?

They really should send for reinforcements. Smarter ones.

Yea.......that is very obvious.

TFF

LOL

Just cite one example.....

There is plenty of text to choose from......wouldn't you agree?

Gotta give SLM credit........he bites a mean ankle.

To all the “I choose to shoot elk with a 243” crowd.......

You all know you’re the Ned Beatty of the canoe trip.

Golly, Beav.

RIO7 told me it was because I was angry.

Of course not, you ain't mikewiener......

Are we shooting elk, or freezer burnt rabbits?

Might?

Where the hell did you see the pics?

But there is no way in hell I’m wearing shiny brown dress shoes.

Why not give WAM some more.....for his detector?

We did the annual Wyoming varmint/shed hunt in early April instead of May. #4 son insisted on getting an early advantage. #5 son came along.........as did the luckiest woman to ever walk the planet.

We pulled the little Casita out and stayed at the free campground in Douglas. Little wire elk out in front of the shower house.

Early April.......Horseshoe Creek area was very snowed in.........as was Fetterman road.

Win some, lose some.

Packed up rifles and headed up north to Thunder Basin.........another trophy Elk zone. There are prairie dogs there too.....if you know where they are.

Found many sheds up there(deer and elk).....but few were this year's. Brett found a decent fresh 6 point set. Found many broken-off points up there. Those big bulls are scrappers.

Found a couple carcasses........probably expert 243 shooters.

Most all the bull elk we saw still had their horns. Sorry experts, antlers.

Shot just a few prairie dogs.

We normally fish Toltec one day.......but Fetterman being closed jacked that. Could have came in from the South, but a long drive around.

Overall......given our goals for the trip.....we chose unwisely. Snow and most elk still carrying horns.

Brett claimed he won the competition for daily mileage.....Little less than 20 miles. I didn't wear the watch, so I walked farther. It was a vacation, why go nuts?

There are no date restrictions for shed hunting there......like there is on the west side. Rest assured, experts.

We drew zone 7 cows tags....starts August 15th for rifle, on private land......through December 31st.

We plan to do labor day week, archery. Mid October for the rifle opener.......late November......and December (late last year, got the Covid).

Plenty for WAM's detector.

We have pictures of all the sheds.......if any expert would like to provide an email address or cell phone number.

Between Iowa and Wyoming, Brett found over 100 sheds this spring (not all on my properties). Found (and left) 3 Iowa trophy skullplates too.......darn expert hunters. They're everywhere.

They probably didn't die of a rifle shot.......scenarshooter says rifles are illegal for deer in Iowa.

And still nothing to make your opinion of shooting elk with a .243 worth a dam.

Keep it up, you’re doing great.

In the hands of an expert....

This non-expert's hands are wrapping gauze around his ankles.

Now THAT is some seriously funny stuff right there! Chronicles of a private land cow elk hunter and his man boy.

And THIS HERE continues to be funny as well... carry on Mike Weiner.

Is WAM's Gay Alarm going off yet?

You married, Greenhorn? To a woman?

We hunt public, walk-in areas, and HMA's.

Surely you know all about them.

YOU'VE HUNTED MORE THAN MOST!

TFF

LOL

I’d hate Mitch Rompola too had he fathered my children. Very sorry Weiner.

Are you married, Greenhorn? Simple yes or no should suffice.

If you're not.......scenarshooter should be worried.

It's seems so much more than fanboy.

This is telling right here Mike, whether you realize it or not. Most people on here wish Pat would post more pics and in fact he posts a fraction of what he could. Most don't begrudge him for the success represented in those pics.

How are those sour grapes tasting?

What headlights?

LOL

Thank you.

I've seen plenty of headlights.......on guys my age.

How old is WAM?

Hate to break up the love-fest here...and I don't get on this board much anymore for just this reason.

A handful of actual elk hunters surrounded by a whole bunch of dumbchits that give advice on caliber choices for elk that have shot one or two their whole life.

I guess maybe this elk my 13 year old nephew shot last fall in Montana, at 362 yards with my late grandfathers .243 and a 100 grain nosler solid base...apparently died of fright, as according to MIKEWERNER, a .243 just won't cut it. Guess neither the dead elk or my nephew got the memo...



Bullet hit just in front of the near shoulder, busted a rib on the exit side about 4 inches behind the off shoulder on its way out. Blood trail was great, took this picture about 5 yards from where he hit it:



About 60 yards later:



I put a new barrel on my 6mm Rem. a couple years ago and shot this elk at about 130 yards with a 95 grain ballistic tip...(shot 3 elk with it before the new barrel as well, all with 100 grain solid base). I'm going to start using this rifle as my go-to for cow elk, tired of shooting that hard kicking 7-08 I've been killing elk with the last 10 years or so.

Where is Greenhorn?

Got a lot of trains in those parts?



Seriously......good pics, Buzz.

My older nephew has shot a couple elk with his 7-08 and 120 grain ballistic tips as well.

I guess another 20 grains of bullet, and .041 inches in diameter must be a huge difference and step up from the .243....or maybe, just maybe the .243 would have resulted in the same 2 dead elk. I'll go out on the ragged edge and say that's a fact.

If there's a difference, shot for shot between a 100 grain .243 and 120 grain from a .284...I didn't notice it...

70 yards, busted the on side shoulder, caught the bullet under the hide on the off-side:



A couple years later, 235 yards:

Same scene but in reverse, went in behind the near shoulder, broke the opposite:

Uh oh, I see another road trip in the wife’s grocery getter coming.

A guy wearing shiny brown dress shoes that has to take 4 trips to pack a cow elk 2 miles might want to reconsider playing the tough guy.

You’ve got everybody on the ropes, don’t weaken now.

Didn't you mention you converted to 6mm relatively late in your hunting life?

After reading your post.......I will have to admit, a lot of doe Pronghorn fell quickly to the 95 grain Ballistic tip.....both .243 and 6mm........in the hands of my then-young sons.

Later, found the .260 to be superior, for a youngsters starter rifle.

For the bigger stuff, prefer larger caliber bondeds and partitions. Premiums, as the experts say.

For the self-proclaiming experts.......please send an email address or phone number.........just a couple thousand pics. May be a phone pic of a hard pic......but you'll see the rifle and animal.

My ankles have gangrene......what more do you want?

The only thing Mike Weiner can teach somebody to do, is how to waste time on a internet forum.

Are you married, Greenhorn?

A fact, huh?

Yeah, I know the country he claims to be hunting real well...and I see no reason to make 4 trips to pack a cow out of any of it. I don't know how many elk my buddies and I have killed out there...but a pile.

Its an elk hunters piece of cake...pretty rare day when I don't kill elk there in an easy assed day hunt.

Shot this one there last fall, was by myself and had it shot, quartered and to the truck before noon:



Two day prior same general area, with a friend, we each shot one toward dark. We quartered them, came back the next morning and had them both to the truck by 9 am:

Is this why you don't frequent these threads?

Surely you know Rodney well, the CO out there. What's his last name, again?

Know where he lives?

Are you familiar with Cow Creek? Who outfits out there, these days?



That open ground is usually very close to a road.
Just sayin'

And.......everyone knows Buzz ain't hiking to the back country. LOL

Greenhorn likes BuzzH's headlights.

If you're trolling for salami, look elsewhere. I have a fine woman. If it's self gratification you're looking for, you can find a couple photos of me HERE. I've no doubt the one with me, the Ruger M77 .243 and B&C whitetail when I was a very young boy will leave a long lasting impression in your spank bank

Uncle Buzz has the headlights you're looking for......

Is BuzzH doing some online research?

This truly gets better every day.

Nice cows Buzz........and nice headlights.

TFF

LOL

BuzzH, a one day hunt?

Really?

Who are talking about?

You mean the game warden on the Douglas side? Rod Leibert? Yeah, I know him, tell him hello for me when you see him next. I killed a pronghorn a number of years ago on a piece of state ground, Rod checked the buck. Landowner pulled up about the same time and Rod and I helped him locate a corner pin on his property boundary. I also helped Rod with a fish poaching case on Glendo.

There's a few wardens and biologists that work that area...I know them all...Knox, Hicks, Sherwood, Binfet, Todd, Brinegar...

Who's outfitting in that area? Better question is who isnt?

It such a tough area, I killed this elk on my way back from a meeting in Casper. Was just planning on glassing for some friends that were coming out later in the week. But, threw the rifle in just in case. First place I stopped to glass...found a bunch. Was my 3rd elk for the year in Wyoming, so picked out one I actually had room for in the freezer:



Cow creek? Never heard of it...laffin'

Thread about cow elk and the 243.

BuzzH puts up results of same.

Seems plain.

BuzzH is value added..

I've hunted in Wyoming plenty. I'm a MT resident, and took a 6X6 bull in WY last year on the Shoshone National Forest. I've also hunted walk-in areas and a few years back my son and I both shot a giant antelope on an HMA. They are both in the B&C record book. I may not hunt more than most, but you can take a walk through my trailer house and decide for yourself.. check it out CLICK HERE -

From Wyoming alone, I think I've taken 6 mule deer bucks, 1 whitetail buck, 1 bull moose, 9 pronghorn antelope bucks, and 4 boar black bears. Gonna be busy this year, my daughters up for a MT bull elk. Son and I also have tags for elk here. I have a Colorado mule deer permit, and a Bighorn Sheep permit - along with a stack of other licenses. I'm hunting for black bear this weekend. How are things in IOWA?

Oh by the way, what caliber should I use for my sheep hunt? Want to keep it light. I've been packing an Kimber .223 shooting 62ttsx for black bear this spring. Is that moronic? Completely rolled a 6.5" boar last spring with it.

Is Rodney gonna remember you? You've surely heard the stories about his semi-pro football career in Wyoming.

You forgot Rodneys local biologist. Do you know his name? Begins with an 'M'. He does the rides in the sky, for game counts......wouldn't let me go along.

Got a zone 7 tag? I be out there, several weeks this fall. Time isn't really an issue, my employer of 36 years is paying me to do whatever I please. Didn't really need them anyway.

Group went 4 for 5 on cow tags, last November (HMA).......me saving a tag for December.....then got Covid and was locked down til the 23rd. Wife told them I was leaving after the local gun seasons here.....County Health said I was in the database and would be arrested if found outside the home.

Government.

When you gonna be out there?

You know none of the outfitters at Cow Creek? Any familiar last names?

Do you remember 'Slicks gun shop'....in Douglas?

September and October it will be Werner and 4 of the 5 sons. Send a PM......I'll buy you your favorite beverage.

Surely WAM's BS detector will go off. He's pretty sharp.

Very impressive, Greenhorn.

YOU REALLY HAVE HUNTED MORE THAN MOST!

TFF

LOL

Most all the GF guys/gals know who I am in this part of the world, including the Director, assistant directors, commission, biologists, wardens. I've worked with a lot of them for a long time.

Why would I give a chit who outfits Cow creek? Most of its public anyway.

Yeah, I'll be out there hunting some this fall. Have 2 buddies from ND, 1 from MT and one from AZ that have 7 elk tags to fill, 3 bull tags and 4 cow tags. They're good hunters and know a local that finds them a lot of elk to shoot...usually a 1-2 day deal. I've helped them on 2 hunts out there, 2018 and 2019...6/6.











My NR nephew also drew a bull tag this year out there, 100% draw odds with no points. I hope to find him a nice 6 point or better bull to kill...anyway as big as we can find.

For God’s sake Buzz - don’t let them consider a .243

How do you get the tags after the draw?

You must have some great connections with Wyomings Game and Fish.

So, you've never met Matt?

That's weird........I have talked to him more times in the field than Rodney.

One time I was changing a flat......another time I was stuck.

Never have less than 2 spares with your wife-cruiser F-150......unless you have 10 ply's.

Lesson learned......back in the 80's.

You're sick....

Lots of fences and wide open-country coupled with heavy-set/chubby hunters.

Good call.

I really enjoy hunting with those guys, they slum it here at the double-wide/hunting shack in the basement when they come to hunt:






I always make sure they have enough beverages on hand:

I really think you should invest in a .243 but I can't help you with your family, relationship, or genetic challenges..

LOL

OK, I deserved that.

Whatever you say...they've hunted elk with me twice with cow tags, 6/6 and last year with general tags, 3/3....and it doesn't take them 2 months to fill their tags, usually 1-2 days. One year the went 3 days before filling their tags. Got 2 the first day...filled out the last tag on the 3rd day.

Yeah, I think this guy probably pushes all of 140...including his rifle. They drew general tags last year. We watched a small knot of elk right at daylight and my friend shot his first bull. Just right at 450...with a 7RM. They're all excellent shots...and I reckon wouldn't be hamstrung with a .243 on elk either.

I see a bottle of whiskey and some Canadian Zippo fluid.

Dang it........nice 5 point.

As an Iowa Outfitter (since '97)......with a ton of Pope and Youngs entered.....some even qualifying for Boone and Crockett..........got any book elk?

I've hunted with a Wyoming general tag.......west side.......out by Alpine......archery........Middle Creek.......3.5 miles back.......shot a 5 pt, little better than that one.

Took 4 of us 1 trip out.........next day..........with empty frame packs, going in.

Where is WAM?

You've got a bad case of fluid on the brain.

You have a bad case of uninformed taste in whiskey.

Fair enough.......Guilty.........I don't partake.

I have one P&Y, none that make B&C...372 and change gross, 358 5/8 net. Public land with my Dad and Brother. We had a day to kill before they started hunting pronghorn so went for a quick morning deal. Was a brutal pack out...about 30 feet to the bed of the pickup on a two-track.

BuzzH.......gotta give you that one.....even given shot placement.

Nice bull.

Tell that dead bull all about the shot placement...

Nice bull Buzz.

You guys STILL arguing about putting a hole in lungs killing an elk? Hell bow hunters do it with tiny little energy numbers. Why would a rifle have different results?

Tell ya what. We Will put 100 elk in a pen. I will shoot them in the lungs with a 243. Every one that does not die I will pay you 1000 dollars. If they die you owe me 10 bucks.

I already know who wins.

Zone 7 bull tag 100% draw rate?

Come on, Man.

No preference points.......worse than 120/1 odds, for a bull tag.

Hilarious.

For those that pay attention...good things happen.

You'll find out pretty quick there are those in the know, and those that THINK they are...

Please explain the 100% draw rate for your non-resident nephew........with no preference points.

Do you know how many preference points it normally takes for a non-resident to draw just a general tag?

Looking forward to your response.

Do you know any of the Werners in Douglas, by chance?



More to come.....

That tag is definitely a 100% draw for NR! Good luck Buzz. Hope you find the nephew a good bull buddy!

LOL

I have a few more questions for BuzzH..........when he returns. These experts sure know how to humble a common guy.



Where is WAM with his alarms?

More to come.......

"When you find yourself in a hole....."

Fire up the backhoe.

Of the elk I've killed, I can think of only one shot I wouldn't have taken with the 243 - the rest would have been just as dead had I been using a 243. I'd not feel handicapped or under-gunned were I told I could only elk hunt with a 243 the rest of my life.

But I'm not from Iowa...

Great post, Brad.

Piling on..........while BuzzH has me on the ropes.

Guy shot this one with a 7mm Mag.........but 243 would have been the same.

Another guy shot this one with a 7-08........but 243 would be same.....that's a fact.

After all......a .308 is just a necked-up .243.

Us Iowans know nothing, especially when it comes to drawing odds.

I really like this place.

TFF

LOL

Well, hey Brad. At least I’ve worked down to a 284 Win. 😉

Mike
Maybe if you took more time reading the Wyoming regs and understanding the draw instead of on the internet acting like a know it all. You would understand that it is indeed 100% odds for the tag his nephew drew.

Give him a moment to overcome his inertia.

Mathman.........you're a numbers guy..........do you buy into the 1000 ft/lbs recommended by your beloved gunwriters.......on deer sized game?

Feel free to show your work.

Post your information.......805. Zone 7, non-resident, bull tag, no preference points........which is what we were discussing. 100% draw.

No Wagonhound.............BuzzH is finding him a decent bull.......remember?

Unless....of course.......all those elk were shot on Wagonhound.

More questions for Buzz, when he returns.



I like this place.

Buzz is like the Tank Murdoch of elk hunting.......with a little scenarshooter mixed in.

Where you at......little, short, chubby guy?

I think I've seen you......rolling out of the truck a couple times.......north of the public property boundaries.

Sure hope there are no challenges in the future.

I am just a common guy.

Hint!!!!!
More coming.....

The only thing you've likely seen of me is my tracks, dust, or the dead elk carcasses....as you try to keep up.

BuzzH........as you should know.......Rodneys biggest conviction resulted from an internet picture.

Hint.

Let the games begin.

Do you know Matt? Or, any of the Werners from Douglas?

What about 'Slicks Gun Shop'?

Really like this place.



More coming.........from just a common guy.

Anyone ever hear that mousetrap snap?

I don't know any Werners....but I do know this guy. I helped him pack this raghorn out of designated wilderness, and several others elk he's killed with a .243 and 100 grain nosler partitions.



Good friend, who I asked one day, after I watched him kill 2 elk in about 3 minutes with his .243 just how many elk he's shot with it. He had to think about it, and said, "over 40 for sure".

Gets after the elk and the work pretty good for a guy 78...

What kinda diversion is that, BuzzH?

Does not surprise me you know nothing of the Douglas Werners, Rodney, or Matt.

Do an internet search........you'll look less stupid.

Where is the 100% bull draw.....in zone 7?

LOL

Expert hunters intimidate me.

Sure hope there's no challenge..........from one of the great ones.

scenarshooter, with BuzzY........may equal one 'old' lean tough guy.

Super surprised we've never seen you out there.

TFF

Keep looking, you'll figure it out...or not.

I'm not surprised you haven't seen me out there...I dont spend a month to kill an elk out there, like I said, rarely more than a day.

If you savvy that country worth a chit...there was wayyyy more than enough background in one of the pictures to know exactly where it was taken.

Should be able to figure where these were taken too...was waiting on a couple friends from Wisconsin to show up. While I waited found maybe 2-3 hundred elk on publicly accessible land. They made good once they showed up and each took cows later in the day.



Pretty long poke on this one, just a pinch over 620 with a 7-08.



A good friend of mine from MT shot one first from the same herd:



This should look familiar...you've mentioned it:



Buddy and I zapped two about 10 minutes after I took the above photo:





Honestly, you have to be the worlds chittiest elk hunter to have spend even 3-4 days killing elk out there.

Had a buddy from MT show up one day about noon...told him I may know an area out there that had elk.

Took a quick spin...found these:



Worked out right fair...put a great stalk on this bunch.

Let my buddy shoot first, I plucked one that hung around too long and filled my 3rd WY elk tag for the season.

I just want to say to ALL the PM'ers......

Yea.....you all know BuzzH is full of it......as do I.

Have the stones to say it yourself........without my proof.

Open ground, fencelines........everyone knows.

He's Tank Murdoch!

A little group of elk...........WOW!

He's a chubby, little, short-legged guy.....

but he has shot a couple elk.

Napoleon syndrome.

Hope no challenges!!!!!!!

Yeah, I think I've shot about 3 elk in my life, something like that.

A few general WY elk out in the open ground:

Well, maybe sand-bagging...maybe its actually 4.

More general WY bulls:

Know anything about Wagonhound, BuzzH?

Rodney know you? When was that Glendo poaching sting operation?

LOL!

Please tell us all, little guy!

Great bull pics........BTW!

Just love this place.

Yeah, I know about the wagonhound and lets just say that McCarty and I don't agree on much of anything.

Never set foot on it, if that's what you're implying. I've shot exactly one elk on private land that isn't accessible to the public, in Montana near Deer Lodge, when I was 15 years old, spike:



The other 76 have all been on publicly accessible ground.

Hell, I don't remember exactly when it was...maybe 8 years ago. I talked to Rod on the phone and sent him a video Pat O'Grady posted of himself icing about a dozen walleyes while the camera never stopped running. I do know O'Grady lost his license for a year over it...ask Rod, he'll tell you about it I'm sure.

What's next, you don't believe I've ever fished Glendo or caught a walleye?

BuzzH, Good work. Rio7

These types of challenges terrify me:

1. I am worth more than you.

2. I have taken more head of big game than you.

3. I own more land than you.

4. I own more rifles than you.

5. I am physically tougher than you.

6. I am more intelligent than you.

7. I can out-walk you.

8. I have been married to the same woman longer than you have.

9. I have more ex-wives than you do....

Please don't prey on my insecurities.......

As Seinfeld was quoted........now we're getting somewhere.

More coming........

Don't you have a tall fence to repair?

Couldn't care less about any of those things.

I just like to hunt and fish.

No challenges?

Just a poor common guy, here.

You know about all the BWI's on Glendo? What year was that?

Ever heard of 'Slicks Gun Shop'? Douglas....

Where are "we getting"?

I think Wagonhound runs a decent business that sounds pretty plush, catering to hunters that like an easy elk hunt for solid, but not great, bulls. I personally wouldn't spend 10-12K for a 270-320 class bull, which a vast majority of the bulls they kill there are exactly that.

He's found what works for him and his clients, can't ask for more than that, we live in America. Willing buyer, willing seller and all that.

The disagreement is over elk management, tag distribution, etc....which is another, how did you put it? Hint?

How do you get to 100% non-resident, bull tag draw, BuzzH?

I'm not your secretary...you figure it out, what with all your connections and clan living in Douglas and your vast experience in the unit in question.

Unbelievable...

Buzz........surely you've heard of the bunny shots at the wild game feed, in Douglas. Hotel LaBonte.

Do you know Dana Fitzhugh.......George Faulkenburgs family..........the Clausen ranch........all around Poison Lake Road?

Varmint hunted those places in the past. Shot a few 'bounty' coyotes......prairie dogs too. We could never possibly match scenarshooters numbers on coyote.....but it helped a little on the gas money.

You appear rather uninformed.........for a Wyoming resident.

Ask Dana if he remembers me pulling/riding that 28 inch mulie off the mountain.

I called it the razor ridge.......south side of his house.

Google search.........

Garrett and Jeff were George Faulkenburg's sons.

We hiked (as a family)....years past....... a few times up to the mountain lion cave. Lots of bones......a few bats.....a back room with many etchings, some dated back to the 40's.

Right off Poison Lake Road.......north, steep ridge.

Other side of road from lake.

Found 1 elk shed up on top, there.......this year.

State ground.

Why the bitterness, Buzz?

You just said you hunted the area I claimed to hunt......

Trying to get some pointers, here.

Who in the absolute [bleep] cares who or what Mike Weiner knows or thinks..

Someone that cares enough to post?

Someone who has 'HUNTED MORE THAN MOST'.

That's who.

Bitter?...

Pretty excited for my nephew, but not bitter...