AS,

You forget that murdering the innocent is Yahweh's most noticeable trait.

As far as penal substitutionary atonement goes, it contradicts itself. Forgiveness means to 'release a debt'. If God is 'paid off' by a blood sacrifice that pays for all of humanity's sins then there is nothing to forgive....he's gotten his payoff. All men are now 'justified'.

Christians like to claim that your debt is paid but you must 'accept' this free 'gift' for you to be forgiven. Complete comtradiction.

If, say, I owe Gus a debt and you pay it off for me, YOU are showing mercy, not Gus. Gus has gotten his payment and I am now free and clear of my debt to him whether I accept it as being true or not!

He will not/can not punish me for not believing or accepting my debt has been paid off much less condemn me to pay it off forever (that's a lot of vig!). The debt has been paid...period. Gus has not 'forgiven' me...he got his payoff.

The entire 'theory' of substitutionary atonement is so bizarre, contradictory, stupid and evil that it could only have been dreamt up by superstitious, ancient humans. This was no doubt to control the populace for in a Monotheistic society where sacrifices are demanded by 'God' and those sacrifices are administered completely by the 'priesthood', guess who is in control? Israel's Kings were basically emasculated rulers. The real powers were the Levites--but that's another whole topic for another thread.

Oh, and don't forget...god 'does not delight in the blood of bulls or lambs' nor takes 'delight in sacrifices' but the 'sacrifices of the lord are a broken spirit; a broken spirit and a contrite heart he will not despise.'

Someone shoulda told Jesus....


It ain't what you don't know that makes you an idiot...it's what you know for certain, that just ain't so...

Most people don't want to believe the truth~they want the truth to be what they believe.

Stupidity has no average...