Originally Posted by Mule Deer
Hi Alvaro,

To tell the truth, I dunno if mass matters as much with Berger Hunting VLD's as it does with high-weight-retention bullets. All the Bergers penetrate 2-3 inches before starting to expand, and do a lot of interior damage, whether the bullet is aa 115-grain .25 or a 185-grain .30.

The real advantage in extra weight is higher ballistic coefficient, which reduces wind drift and increases impact velocity on longer shots. At 500 yards the 168 will be going the same velocity as the 140, and beyond that will be faster.


Your point about extra weight is true if other factors, such as velocity, are the same. That's not the case here, though, where Alvaro states a 140g @ 3100fps and a 168g @ 2800fps. Given those starting velocities, your conclusion about velocity at 500 yards is incorrect.

Assuming 10,000 feet for "mountain game", 70 degrees and MPBR zeros for a maximum 3" rise above LOS, the facts are these:

140g Berger VLD @ 3100fps, BC .517, Zero = 270 yds, MPBR = 318 yds
145g Barnes LRX @ 3100fps, BC.486, Zero = 269 yds, MPBR = 317 yds
168g Berger VLD @ 2800fp ,BC .617, Zero - 248 yds, MPBR = 293 yds
168g Barnes LRX @ 2800fps, BC .550, Zero = 247 yds, MPBR = 291 yds

500 yards
=================
140g VLD = 2487fps, 1923fpe, -24.8" drop. 9.96" drift
145g LRX = 2459fps, 1947fpe, -25.2" drop, 10.5" drift
168g VLD = 2320fps, 2007fpe. -32.0" drop, 9.27" drift
168g LRX = 2265fps, 1913fpe, -33.0" drop, 10.6" drift

800 yards
=================
140g VLD = 2157fps, 1447fpe, -103.1" drop, 27.3" drift
145g LRX = 2116fps, 1441fpe, -105.2" drop, 29.8" drift
168g VLD = 2056fps, 1577fpe, -124.9" drop, 25.4" drift
168g LRX = 1974fps, 1453fpe, -129.6" drop, 29.0" drift

1000 yards
=================
140g VLD = 1952fps, 1184fpe, -191.2" drop, 44.5" drift
140g LRX = 1902fps, 1165fpe, -195.4" drop, 47.1" drift
168g VLD = 1889fpe, 1331fpe, -225.8" drop, 40.9" drift
168g LRX = 1793fps, 1199fpe, -237.0" drop, 47.2" drift

The facts are that inside 1000 yards the 168g VLD never catches up to the 140g VLD in terms of velocity and at 800 yards has 22" more drop with only 2" less drift. If stuck with using VLDs, I'd choose the 140g.

Given a choice, though, I'd choose the 145g LRX. One of the problems I've experienced over the years is my shot ranges are not always what I expect. In 2007 I was expecting shots at 400-600 yards across open land. Instead I ended up taking a cow at 125 yards, passing on a second (already clearly wounded) at 25 feet and then taking one at 40 yards. This year I passed on shots at elk at 220 so my hunting buddy and son-in-law could take one, had another opportunity at maybe 150 but passed because they were moving, waited until they stopped, then took one at 399. My deer this year was in open sage and once again I expected long shots but took one well under 100 yards. I trust the Barnes TTSX and LRX at any range I'd be willing to take a shot, and, having driven them through mulies lengthwise, at any angle. Can't say the same for a bullet that is advertised to produce a 13-15" wound channel. The VLDs might be great at long ranges but I simply don't trust them to hold together at close range. The Barnes tipped X bullets do hold together and more game we've taken with them have dropped instantly than not.



Coyote Hunter - NRA Patriot Life, NRA Whittington Center Life, GOA, DAD - and I VOTE!

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