My complaint is, how is the 6.5 Creedmoor any different than a 6.5 jap. or a 6.5 carcano, or a 6.5 manlicher. Those old cartridges had fast twist barrels, modest velocity, low recoil, heavy for caliber bullets. What Hornady did wasn't rocket science. Hornaday took an old idea and made it there own.