Originally Posted by shaman
Originally Posted by jwp475


A 30/30 blows large wound channels through deer and kills them grave yard dead




Yes and no.

Yes, it can blow large wound channels.

No. It doesn't necessarily kill them straight off.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not going to say a 30-30 is ineffective, but I did have an experience where I shot a small doe from a treestand with a Marlin 336. I put multiple shots into her while she just stood there. The end result was watching her walk off with a softball-sized hole in her chest and an 8 foot spurter coming out of her. She wandered about 40 yards, and finally keeled over.

The details are here: Ode to a 30-30 PT III

Another thing I will say is that 30-30 used to be the chambering of choice in my part of the world. Our camp is in SW Bracken County KY, in ZONE 1. We have unlimited antlerless deer permits. It is an opportunity-rich environment. The number of shot strings on the Rifle Opener is phenomenal-- 3/minute on a good one. Back 20 years ago the vast majority of neighbors shot 30-30 and you would hear multiple shots coming from the same place as somebody unloaded their mag at a deer. Over 20 years, those guys have retired from hunting or moved on. The weapon of choice nowadays is 30-06 and 308 and you seldom hear more than 2 shots coming from the same direction at once. Hunter numbers have gone down over the years. Harvest numbers have gone up.

Does that mean that 30-30 was ineffective? No. Did it mean all my neighbors were booger-eating morons? No. What I will say about these 30-30 arguments is that too often I hear pronouncements about 30-30's and various other over-discussed topics, and the guys poo-pooing a perfectly legitimate position come off sounding rather isolated and close-minded.

I've experimented with a bunch of deer rifles and chamberings over the years. Some have been spectacularly good. I'd say my latest, experiment, the 7mm08 was a hands-down winner. Others, like the 44 Mag, have been about what you'd expect. If you look in my reloading log, you'll probably find more experimental 30-30 loads than any other. Yes, I've taken deer with it, but I always found it a little wanting, and I have always figured I could do better.

Am I going to give up on 30-30? No, I'll keep at it. I dig my 30-30 rifles, and want to succeed with them. However, I had to finally admit that there were going to be better chamberings for me.



Those kinds of things can happen occasionally with any cartridge. Chances are that doe would have died just as quickly and gone no further if you'd have stopped shooting after the first shot. She was dead on her feet and just didn't know it. I had a similar experience many years ago with 12 gauge foster slugs. Pumped 4 of them through the lungs of a young buck from 30 yards before he finally figured out he was in a bad spot, trotted off 40 yards and keeled over. Another time I put a 12 gauge foster slug through both lungs of a broadside doe and watched her run 250 yards across a field before she went down. That's the farthest I've ever had a lung shot deer go with any cartridge. Do you suppose that means 12 gauge slugs aren't good deer killers at close range ? I have also used many different cartridges to kill deer over the last 44 years including .22LR, .22 mag., 5mm Remington rimfire mag., .222, .223, .22-250, .243, 6.5 Creedmoor, 7x57 mm Mauser, .30-30, .308, .30-06, .357 mag., .35 Rem., .44 mag., 20 gauge and 12 gauge slugs and I can't say any have really been more effective at woods ranges than the .30-30. Just last season I had a doe run 50-60 yards after taking a 150 gr. Federal Fusion bullet from my .30-06 through the lungs. I've had many others do the same with everything from .222 on up. The year before I shot a middling sized 7 point buck through both shoulders with one of those same bullets out of my .30-06 and recovered it from under the hide on the far side. That buck dropped instantly, just as it would have with the same shot placement from my .30-30 but I'm quite sure a 170 grain bullet out of my .30-30 would have exited as it has numerous times on even bigger bucks in the past. I am every bit as confident of making meat going into the woods with my .30-30 during deer season as I am with any other rifle in my safe. It has worked and worked well too many times in the past for me to feel any differently.