hey art peck aka sitka deer, of achorage, ak. i sent you a stock to inlet a cartridge trap about a year ago. i paid for that service in full with a .25 caliber barrel blank. we also discussed a foreend tip and grip cap out of 2 of 4 materials to be done by you and paid with cash when completed. over this year we exchanged some pm's, you never did tell me what materials you were going to use, and never sent pics of the work you said was done.
the last time you replied to a pm was on 11/23/10, yeah, 4 months ago. at that time you said i pissed you off and you don't do good work when not thinking happy thoughts or something to that contect.
i see where you finally read my last pm to you, asking for my stuff back. i have asked several times in public threads for you to return my property, again no response from you.
you continue to post here and act like the grand pooh bah of stock work.
well, i have a different opinion of you, i think you are a THIEF.
again art peck, i am asking you to return my property.
you have had a year now to do a simple cartridge trap inlet, and as was agreed, a foreend tip out of ebony or african black wood, and a grip cap out of cape buff. horn or water buff. horn. either of which you have never told me.
now is time for all the members here to know you are a dishonest thief.
you said 4 months ago there were some problems, of which i do not understand,and it would take a little time to work out. that was 4 months ago, with no updates, replies, contacts, or returned phone call. yeah, that was me that left a message on your home phone.
art, I WANT MY PROPERTY BACK, NOW.
i can't get any clearer than that. enough, is enough, of your games or thievery. whichever you want to call it.
having never done business with the above named individual, i must abstain from opining as to his business practices...
i will say that 10 years ago i would never have sent a rifle off to a smith that i'd not met face-face... 2 years ago i sent a model 70 to Redneck who is a member here, based on his apparent reputation...
Redneck does what he says he'll do, ships when he says he'll ship, and promptly answers all phone calls, messages, and emails...
the last time you replied to a pm was on 11/23/10, yeah, 4 months ago. at that time you said i pissed you off and you don't do good work when not thinking happy thoughts or something to that contect.
I would bet there are no happy thoughts after this either
I hope Art will man up and return Splatt's property before it all gets legal and sticky for him. Man up Art, return his property and admit you screwed up.
Go back to the thread Kodiadisland posted, Art has had plenty of chances to clear this up and is acting like a hard headed fool.
I know Splatt, met him over the net on a gunboard, met in person at a rifle shoot, hunt with him, can access his house like it was mine. The guy is good on his word and is just a plain good guy. I would and have trusted him with my life.
Maybe "cowman" being Art's buddy can send him a message to answer up and just send the property back and be done with it.
The only way to pick sides is to go with the person that you have interacted with so I'm in Art's camp on this one. I have a feeling that Splatterman pissed Art off pretty bad... Bad enough that he don't care what is posted about him... It would be interesting what kind of PM's Art received...
#1037400 - 02/26/10 01:45 AM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Yes, quite a few of them... _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1037905 - 02/26/10 10:51 AM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Specifics? _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1037991 - 02/26/10 11:56 AM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2837 Loc: n.w. new mexico i am not a wod working kind of guy, i try, but... it's seems without knowledge and proper tools, i mess things up.
fellow member kend, finished a stock for me. it turned out okay, but needs more work. i can do the finish again, but i had to put a cross pin in, which i did at my gunsmithing class last tuesday night.
i amgoing to put a plastic grip cap on still, but i have the cartridge trap i'd like to do, but since it's a beautiful piece of wood, and everythigs going good so far, i'd hate to mess it up doing that last part.
here's a link to to it with pics of what i have. the inner piece is drilled for 22 hornets, but is not needed, just the part under the sling swivel stud area of the door. so it could be cut off, and just sealed wood in the area where the shells go up in.
#1038300 - 02/26/10 02:45 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Without the piece in hand the shape of the bottom edge of the stock cannot be determined... Assuming the shapes match neatly it is just a couple hours to put them in. If the curves do not match well it is entirely different and would involve reshaping the bottom of the stock... or shaping metal to match wood. Either of those could take quite a bit of time to do it right...
I tend to do those with the initial build or skip them. If you want me to look at it and give you an idea of what is involved I could do that... If the install is a reasonable fit we could trade barrel blanks or something for the work.
I charge $50 per hour for my time and usually charge an extra $30 an hour when I have to use the mill or lathe to make them pay for themselves, but these are usually just a little drillpress time followed by handwork. art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1038421 - 02/26/10 03:59 PM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2837 Loc: n.w. new mexico okay deal... without sending it, if i lay the trap on the stock and take pics from every and any angle would that work ?
if not i need an addie to send the stock and blank. that way you can also look at the blank and make sure it's what you want, and if not i will pay.
and check out that thread again in just a bit, new pics up. it shot like a 4 shot 5/8" group. so the barreled action likes the new stock. yeah, i did the bedding correctly. looks kinda crappy under the barrel, but, hey noone will ever see it !
lemme know if pics will work and i'll start taking them.
#1038496 - 02/26/10 04:26 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Better yet, make a gauge... Just a slot cut in a piece of wood exactly the same width of the trap and exactly the same depth as it is high. Set it on the ridge of your stock and see how close it is to touching both sides and the bottom edge of the stock...
Take pictures of the gauge in place if you have questions. A tablesaw, router, or files by hand should do it quickly... It does not need to be more than an inch long... _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1038500 - 02/26/10 04:27 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA I make one full length as my primary lay-out tool when starting... _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1039795 - 02/27/10 02:28 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA It is looking good! The pictures do not give the details well, but I will give it a good in-hand look if it works out and give you what I know...
Being a shooter like it is you can get a lot of slack on details! art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1053340 - 03/07/10 07:12 AM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2837 Loc: n.w. new mexico i am among the living again ! had a kidney stone the beginning of the week, then just a lot of complications, then i spent all day yesterday in the er, had high fever, felt like my whole body got beat by a ball bat. they took x rays, blood, piss, flue swab, etc... the doc had no idea what was wrong with me. the whole time i was there, my fever just kept going higher, til it hit 102.7. they were getting worried.
still feel like [bleep], they gave me another antibiotic, in my iv. i may have had side effects to the one i got at the beginning of the week, when i passed the stone.
so anyways, i made the gauge. it is the same width and depth as the long strip part of the trap, where the sling stud goes.
i need to to cut it smaller. before i go cutting on it, i used a piece of 2x4 and ran a mill bit into it.
how long would you like me to make it ? you said 1 inch. i can do that, but just checking.
let me know please, i'll cut it, remove the sling stud in the stock, place this gauge there, take pics, and send em.
#1053500 - 03/07/10 08:50 AM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Mark All I need is for you to run the gauge down the length of the inlet site and see how it fits. That will tell you whether the stock finish will have to be messed with. Usually they do not fit perfectly... and stock work is required. Which is why they are usually installed from the beginning.
If it is way off you need to decide if it is worth it... or if a piece of stell can be machined to make up the difference.
Headed back to the gunshow here in a few minutes and will not be back until late.
No personal kidneystone experience, but it cannot be good... Sorry to hear you had to deal with that. art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1055937 - 03/08/10 05:46 PM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2837 Loc: n.w. new mexico i took 2 pics of the jig. the finish is nothing but tru oil so fixing the finish will be easy if it get's boogered up a little.
the slot is the exact width and depth of the skinny end that starts at the sling swivel stud end.
if these aren't enough pics to tell by, lemme know what you need and i'll take more. first pics is looking back towards the butt.
this is looking from right at the stud hole forward.
#1056439 - 03/08/10 09:52 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Mark It look like a thickish ordinary US stock shape and a typical very thin cartridge trap cover... It looks like it will take some stock work to make it fit, well beyond a simple inletting of the trap... art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1056483 - 03/08/10 10:38 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA the stock is thicker where the trap is desgined to be positioned. Blending wood into metal means the stock needs to be thinned out through its length so the trap matches the curve of the stock...
It will be more then just cutting down the stock and making it fit. art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1056931 - 03/09/10 09:00 AM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Mark Did you do the stockwork? Just trying to give you a feel for what would be involved...
Euro stocks tend to be much skinnier as they do not tend toward big magnums with lots of recoil and they tend to cast their stocks to control recoil rather than using sissy pads and muzzle brakes. They also use cartridge traps far more often than we do.
Reshaping the butt is not all that big of a deal, but the shape of the rest of the stock would not blend well with the butt then... art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1057041 - 03/09/10 10:26 AM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2837 Loc: n.w. new mexico i guess i need to surf the web and look at what i could find for pics of euro stocks and traps. i pulled out my mauser model 66 and looked it over, and am not sure what i am looking at i guess ? the bottom of the stock actually is a bit thicker than my stock... so i am guessing it's not a good example, of what you mean.
where should the sides of my jig be touching the stock? eye balling it, and not knowing what i am looking for, the rounded top of the trap to the sides, appear to match up pretty good with the edge of the stock and appears when inletted would make a rounded look, without a step so to speak where the edges would meet the stock side.
tryimg to put this into words here.. when looking from the rear, when i lay the trap on the stock, where the sides of the stock come up, if the trap was inletted to the depth of the gauge i made, the rounded trap top, seems it would just look like the rounded bottom line of the stock... it doesn't appear that when the wood would end the metal began, there would be a step of anything not flowing together.
took some more pics of the trap in place before i sent this post.
#1057085 - 03/09/10 10:49 AM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA The pictures are not making sense to me in this last go around. I thought I saw a great deal of distance in your jig (when it was in place on the stock) between the stock and the jig. That would mean the curve of the stock does not match the trap.
The photos of the trap on the stock do not look that far off.
Is the jig the same size as the widest part of the trap? It should be... Or is it the same size as the tang end with the hinge? It should NOT be... art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1057123 - 03/09/10 11:05 AM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2838 Loc: n.w. new mexico i misunderstood which end you wanted then. i made it as wide and as deep as the what you call the tang end, where the sling stud holds it in the stock. it is more narrow there and flares out toward the front on the other side of the hinge.
guess i need to make another jig.
or would the trap itself work, kinda like i have it laying on the stock ?
#1057157 - 03/09/10 11:42 AM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2838 Loc: n.w. new mexico there's some more ...
i folded the trap and turned it around so you can see the forward end of it about where it would lay when it is flat and the stud is holding it in place.
i am sure it can be moved backwards a bit if needed as the stud hole could become the retaining pressure spring hole.
i tried to line it up as straight as possible, and the gap you are looking at may be a bit higher in reality as the part of the hinge at the grip side may be holding it tilted down just a bit more than if it was flat.
#1057169 - 03/09/10 11:51 AM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2838 Loc: n.w. new mexico trying to measure it, i come with about the same distance of gap as the metal is thick.
i am not exact, but it's close. so i am thinking the depth it has to go in, would recess the trap enough for it to be just about flush with the exteriors outside lines.
maybe just a lil bit of shaping the outside edge of the trap to flow with the stock ?
am i thinking correctly on how this works... this sucks not being able to do this myself, or understand wood working.... someday, i will.... but right now.... i am as dumb as a box of rocks....
and not having the proper tools, or knowing how to use them.
#1059017 - 03/10/10 11:55 AM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2838 Loc: n.w. new mexico well ? whatta ya think ? is it going to work ? or are you studying it still, or do i need more pics, or ?
#1059039 - 03/10/10 12:01 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA mark It looks like it should work, especially if the sides of the trap can be dressed down a little to match up. art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1059094 - 03/10/10 12:33 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Sounds good to me. Art Peck 761 High View Dr Anchorage AK 99515
I may still have issues when it arrives, but we can discuss those then. art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1063685 - 03/13/10 07:43 AM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2838 Loc: n.w. new mexico everything is going out today. i have 2 empty casings in the bag for fitting for the holes up in the butt.
the box is going priority, so it should be there close to the end of the week or sooner.
thank you art, your helping my dream of a custom rifle come together.
#1069231 - 03/16/10 02:22 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Nothing yet, but our mail has been delivered later and later each day... Usually gets here within the next two hours.
Will let you know when it arrives. _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1069282 - 03/16/10 02:45 PM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2838 Loc: n.w. new mexico great !
thank you. i hope it all fits without much fuss. the inside plate is driled for .22 hornet, but cutting off that part with the holes leaves the tail end under the sling swivel stud area for proper hieght install. just 4 holes i think will fit for the 280ai casings to fit in, we'll call it, bare wood, instead of the metal that was cut off.
but i think you know about all this already, so i just keep my mouth shut.
#1069299 - 03/16/10 02:52 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Has the metal been removed already? It may have been needed, especially to get hole spacing correct, but it may have worked out using it... _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1069307 - 03/16/10 02:58 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Okay. That's good. _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1071214 - 03/17/10 07:20 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Got the package and everything is in fine shape.
The trap will not be an issue to install. Did not realize it is in the white and essentially unshaped... Are you going to do the polishing or is that something you want me to do?
My steps: Install metal in wood which will leave a little metal proud.
Reduce metal to shape of stock.
Next step is to polish metal, which can take a while... I can reduce metal edges to match the stock, leaving metal proud for you to draw file to shape... Or I can do it. WIll not take long, but can be tricky... art
_________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
page 3 have never done anything like this before in my life. if you could do it all, i would be indebted to you for the rest of our lives.
i think there is a guy around here still doing hot bluing,(i'll call him tomm., and see) so if it's ll done and ready, i can give it to him to blue, and then it's completely done.
do you think at least 4 shells will fit in it ?
know anyone who does checkering and final finish on the stock?
i'd like to do some kind of pistol grip cap as well, but it's not oval shaped exactly, so one would have to be fitted. any ideas of one that can be shaped a lil and not look funky because of the shaping ?
how do you like the blank ? will it work for you ?
#1071623 - 03/18/10 12:31 AM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Mark Slapping a matching ebony fore end tip and grip cap on there would not be tough or time consuming... I have scads of options for woods beyond ebony... I also have dall sheep horn, mammoth ivory, fossil walrus ivory, cape buffalo horn, water buffalo horn, rosewoods of at least two dozen varieties, African blackwood, banksia pod, redwood burl, and the list goes on...
Since you did the finishing I can mount a grip cap radiused and matching your grip (Riley REALLY liked the shape and thinks his next stock will have the swell) in wood with matching fore end tip ready for finishing for about $150. Knowing where you stand on the job front that can be paid when you can, in stages, whatever works for you. The horns and ivory are a bit more dear, but we can work something out.
Trying to do a metal grip cap would be tough...
I could attach a grip cap of ebony or one of the rosewoods that overlaps all edges and let you shape it... probably including more time than it would take me to do it... and then teach you to profile it... and attach a matching fore end tip and profile it so all you have to do is final sanding (they need to be "right" and that is tough to teach long distance) for $100, same terms.
Nothing is that difficult... Just that sometimes the time spent finishing stuff before it was ready can be a problem... art
_________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1071660 - 03/18/10 04:32 AM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2839 Loc: n.w. new mexico mornin,
i have looked at a zillion pics of rifles, and i have never seen fossil walrus ivory, or horn as a grip cap that i can ever recall. sounds cool. but, i am just starting back to work after a bit over 2 months, so payments would work.
look at my pics of the rifle.
it has a blasted s.s. fluted barrel, 26" long. the recvr, mounts and scope are gloss black. the floor plate is matt s.s., screws and studs black. i can change those to either all black, or everything s.s.
i think the forearm is a bit short for the 26" barrel, so a forened cap installed might be made maybe a 1/2 to 3/4 longer than what it's finished at right now.
with that color scheme going on i think rosewood would be too light of a color to match anything, so ebony would be better suited to bring some black up to the s.s. barrel for an offset contrasting color. so if thats what you'd think go for a forend cap, but you can think over the color and do what you think looks best.
the grip cap ??
guess maybe you can pick something cool and unique to make it a custom stock. if ebony to match, that's fine. or maybe pick out something exotic, i will pay. and again, final shaping .. nope not me...
final sanding at 600 grits or so, that's fine,i can do that and i can add the tru oil again as well.
i guess what i am asking or saying, is you are an artist. you have somewhat of a blank canvas to work with. this is a rifle i will have for the rest of my life.
you can have an open mind and make it a truely unique piece, and do what you like.
you have pics of what i have with the complete action and scope, colors, and barrel length. send me back somethng that when i post pics, or show someone, their jaw drops !
#1074888 - 03/20/10 10:36 AM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Mark Tweaked my back a little bit and my sitting time in front of the computer is greatly reduced. It will not be a big issue as it is getting better every day. Funny thing is I did it fixing a friend's back witha lift. He weighs about 280. I should know better.
All horn is a bit gaudy for fore end tips, but subtle in small doses like butt plates, grip caps and trigger guards. art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1074918 - 03/20/10 11:14 AM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2839 Loc: n.w. new mexico okay. i am sorry for your back. i know the feeling, i'm getting old and oil field work takes it's toll some days.
i will leave the stock in your loving hands. i guess since you can see pics of the completed rifle in the stock, you choose what foreend cap and grip cap to do.
surprise me with the choice.
i also need a final finish and checkering. who would you suggest for that ? i don't want anything crazy, just something nice and functionable. i am not too crazy about real fine checkering, nor too course.
and is truoil an okay finish or should it be sanded back down and something else used to bring out the graining ?
thanks art, trying to sell some stocks to fund this.
#1074935 - 03/20/10 11:25 AM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Sherry Abraham is the lady for checkering at a reasonable price. She was head of checkering at Kimber of OR and has been doing this longer than most anyone and is fast and reasonable.
Tru-Oil is a finish I use a lot of. It is not particularlt weatherproof, but no oil finish really is. It is extremely easy to repair. art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1082137 - 03/25/10 03:55 AM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2839 Loc: n.w. new mexico hi art, up n attem already this morning here. was wondering how it was going ? have you decided on what your going to use for the cap's ? inletting going well ?
#1084492 - 03/26/10 05:18 PM Re: got a question for you splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2839 Loc: n.w. new mexico i've got some birthday money that i need to send your way ! how much and what did you have in mind doing to it ?
ebony on the forearm tip and water buffalo on the grip ?
or ??
i see ya read the last pm's and know your back is out, but, the suspense is killing me !
#1084602 - 03/26/10 06:22 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA My sitting and typing time is limited right now...
Ebony or African Blackwood will be on the tip... AB is more gray and I will look to see which looks best with the stock... Most would not know the difference, but AB has more black lines on a dark, dark gray base.
Cape buffalo may be the right thing for the grip. It matches better with AB usually as the water buffalo tends to be a little lighter. Again, I will have to hold it against the stock to see what it looks like.
Let me see what it takes, time wise, to slap these items on and we will go from there. I am pretty efficient on these types of things, especially shaping fore end tips... art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1084611 - 03/26/10 06:26 PM Re: got a question for you Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA I have been teaching two guys to build stocks and their stuff is in my way briefly... We will stab that piece in there soon. art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1109201 - 04/14/10 02:09 AM Re: any updates ? Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA I am slowly geting back to speed with my back. And right in the middle of it we start the AK Fly Fishers booth at the local sportsmans show and then out annual auction this coming Friday... I have been buried.
I should have a chance to make significant progress monday.
Have done a touch of cogitating on it... art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1109235 - 04/14/10 05:16 AM Re: any updates ? splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2840 Loc: n.w. new mexico that's fine. was just wondering. no hurries. been fireforming some nickle 280 cases. gotta have some bling shells to go with a bling gun !
i am up early too, my back is killin me this morning. lower left side just plain hurts real bad today.
i think big trucks and the crappy seats have something to do with it.
i pray you heal quick.
take care and whenever is fine, was just curious as to what you thought you might use.
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Mark Back set me back quite a bit, but catching up and will probably have the stock done this week. All of the install, tip, grip cap will be done, just the finish may delay things slightly if it does not play well with others... Stay tuned for photos... art
_________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1186875 - 06/23/10 03:00 AM Re: any updates ? Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Got a call to make a simple run across the GUlf of Alaska with a smallish boat and left on the 2nd... Should take 4-5 days so I figured I could stretch things and take Riley with me for a glacier bear hunt along the way.
Instead we got hit with heavy Westerly weather for two weeks and hid in Yakutat for it... Got to drive around Icy Bay for a morning and that was the extent of the Glacier Bear hunt...
I am frazzled, more later. art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2840 Loc: n.w. new mexico hi art, going antelope hunting in sept. you think the stock will be ready for it? trying to decide on guns to take and the 280ai is/was one of them.
your killin me... what did you decide for the foreend tip and grip cap ?
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA I am jumping through hoops right and left... will try to get some pictures posted for you... Trying to do them "right" and not doing well because my primary reflector got ripped off and I find I relied on it too much!
Long as I am making you struggle I will turn up the pressure on the thumbscrews... It does not suck... _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1194615 - 07/01/10 04:47 AM Re: any updates ? splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2840 Loc: n.w. new mexico okay, take your time. i can take it in the laminated stock it's in.
fire formed nickle cases for it, and they turned out great. loaded 140 ttsx's and they shoot just as well as factory ai cases. pic's would be nice, but again, just hadn't heard from you, and was checking. i have patiance.
mornin, btw, 4:46 am here leaving for work in ust a few.
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA mark Has been ridiculous... I have been home less than a week total since early June. Will not be home again until late tomorrow... Your stock has the highest priority of the work in the shop. art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
next pm i know your hammered with requests for the guns, and i'd like a list too. but, since you have the camera out, lemme see how the cartridge trap and fore end cap and grip cap look on my stock please.
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA I have some pictures...
Ran into a problem with the shape of the stock... The starboard side is slightly concave and the port side is decidedly perchbellied. When I eyeballed it the trap did not look like it went down far enough to create an issue. I was wrong. I wrongly assumed the perchbelly would hide it.
Have spent more time than I anticipated by a considerable margin. It will not cause you any extra cost as it was my mistake. I have had to work the port side to flatten it... which is better anyway.
Had cut into it before I realized what was going to happen or I would never have gone there. Nothing that cannot be fixed... Just time. art
_________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
#1343813 - 11/08/10 06:24 PM Re: how's my stock coming along ? splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2842 Loc: n.w. new mexico hi art, no response ?
at least give me something on what ya got done to the stock, please. been quite some time you've had it, along with the payment of the barrel, and you've not told me much.
are you able to do it ? if not, it's okay, just send everything back, and i can go to someone else to finish it.
next pm what's up with my stock ? splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2844 Loc: n.w. new mexico i see you've read my pm, been posting and no reply ? i would like to know what's going on with it please.
if you do not respond art, i will air this in public on how you got my stock with the payment of a barrel blank, and how i've tried numerous times to get an answer from you on what you are doing, as well as the agreement of doing a foreend tip and grip out of ??? you have never told me what you planned on using.
you said you did some work and would send me some pics. i was patient when you said you were busy, not home, etc... but, there comes a time now when you must tell me what's going on. i started a thread in ask the gunwriters on what i should do after 8 months of not knowing. go read it. i will call you out if you do not tell me what's going on with my stock.
thank you very much for understanding my position on this matter,
#1363447 - 11/23/10 06:05 PM Re: what's up with my stock ? Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA mark You will get your stock, soon and it will have the wrinkles ironed out... I made a bad choice in doing it for several reasons. The fields are not close to flat and it is a pain. It will not cost you a thing.
The lack of communication is the fact you frankly pissed me off some PMs ago and I do not do my best work when I am not in a good mood. For the sake of your stock I did not work on it while not thinking happy thoughts.
There is about a week of work on the bench now, including your stock. I want to send it out right away, but do not want it to show my work in a bad light.
To repeat, I made a mistake. art _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
next pm #1462423 - 01/24/11 12:25 PM please let me know what's going on with my stock splattermatic Campfire Guide
Registered: 07/25/08 Posts: 2846 Loc: n.w. new mexico hi art, again, i am sorry if there was something i said to tick you off. in no way did i intend to do it purposely.
but, please let me know what's going on with my stock. if you cannot complete it soon, please send it back. if you do not want to finish what you have started then that's fine too, i can send it to karnis, or someone else to complete it.
i would just like my stock back in whatever state it is in. i know it's not some great piece of wood, but it is my first custom stock, and would really like to complete the 280ai project that i started years ago.
please let me know what you intend to do, so i can make other arrangements if needed, or when to expect my stock back. we chatted once before when i traded you the 870 barrel and learned alot about gold and silver, that i had no idea about before. you seemed like a really nice guy, and i do not know why you won't answer me or respond to me on what you have done with the stock, or what your intentions of returning it to me are.
#1572303 - Today at 10:39 AM Re: please let me know what's going on with my stock Sitka deer Campfire Kahuna
Registered: 02/02/01 Posts: 21099 Loc: Anchorage, AK USA Sitka deer has removed themself from this topic. _________________________ Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
I like Art, but he gave you the same run around as Jack Belk gave to me. Belk ended up completley destroying one of my stocks and pretty much ruined the other one. I got one back, then he went insane and dissapeared off the face of the planet.
"The lack of communication is the fact you frankly pissed me off some PMs ago and I do not do my best work when I am not in a good mood. For the sake of your stock I did not work on it while not thinking happy thoughts."
If the above was written with any seriousness, I admit to being very surprised. Either way, sucks when things come to this. Based only on what I've just read, sure sounds like it could have been avoided. Next stop, ugly city. That's all I'm 'contributing' to this thread. <door closes>.
I like Art, but he gave you the same run around as Jack Belk gave to me. Belk ended up completley destroying one of my stocks and pretty much ruined the other one. I got one back, then he went insane and dissapeared off the face of the planet.
Hope this turns out better for you.
Brian.
Jack Belk? Mr. "Expert witness". I can't believe you sent that POS anything............
I won't make an excuses, but I have to say that Art is an upstanding honorable guy.
I've hunted with him, spent nights in a tent with him, he practically led my by hand on my sheep hunt, slept at his house while traveling through Anchorage, broke bread with his wonderful family.
As someone mentioned on another thread... "no good deed goes unpunished."
All this over a cheap looking stock, floor plate, and a barrel? Stick the action in a Hogue, and shoot it already. The stock will arrive when it's right, if I know Art, and I do.
I'm not going to name the gun-maker who held a couple of my super-special custom Mausers (half-done) for thirteen years and stole several hundred dollars' worth of virtually irreplaceable custom hardware.
I've had to relearn, over and over, time and again, that skill is no index of ethics. Some of the best artists are some of the worst crooks.
An engraver whom I used to know (but fortunately couldn't afford) sold some guy's super-expensive shotgun after accepting several thousand dollars for work on it that he never did � then had to hobble around in casts for some time after a couple of the client's thugs worked on his ankles with ball-peen hammers.
I'm not going to name the gun-maker who held a couple of my super-special custom Mausers (half-done) for thirteen years and stole several hundred dollars' worth of virtually irreplaceable custom hardware.
I've had to relearn, over and over, time and again, that skill is no index of ethics. Some of the best artists are some of the worst crooks.
An engraver whom I used to know (but fortunately couldn't afford) sold some guy's super-expensive shotgun after accepting several thousand dollars for work on it that he never did � then had to hobble around in casts for some time after a couple of the client's thugs worked on his ankles with ball-peen hammers.
I won't make an excuses, but I have to say that Art is an upstanding honorable guy.
I've hunted with him, spent nights in a tent with him, he practically led my by hand on my sheep hunt, slept at his house while traveling through Anchorage, broke bread with his wonderful family.
As someone mentioned on another thread... "no good deed goes unpunished."
All this over a cheap looking stock, floor plate, and a barrel? Stick the action in a Hogue, and shoot it already. The stock will arrive when it's right, if I know Art, and I do.
An "upstanding" honorable guy would send the stock back and get on with life.
I question the wisdom of this undertaking and related PMs being put on the general forum for resolution. It's none of our phuggin business. Art has been completely accessible and very kind in offering his time and advice on matters I've raised with him. Art and his lovely wife strike me as nothing other than well rounded,kind decent folks whose integrity is unquestioned by me. I don't know splattermatic other than what I've discerned from the PM streams and the fact he saw fit to publically post his and another's PM exchanges. I have a fundamental problem with that in itself but I do not completely disparage splattermatic for that personal preference of mine. There has to be a way for gentlemen toquickly resolve this without involving 100 other folks.
Pick up your phones and resolve this matter like decent men do and keep it from becoming a blue-haired gossip,accusation and allegiance thread on the main forum. In the future,never forget the first word in PM.
I like Art, but he gave you the same run around as Jack Belk gave to me. Belk ended up completley destroying one of my stocks and pretty much ruined the other one. I got one back, then he went insane and dissapeared off the face of the planet.
If he's married, contact his wife. She may just get him in gear.
I took a ram to a highly regarded taxidermist and waited patiently during the 9 months I was told it would take. I called a couple of times and then started to visit. Each time I was given a story of why it hadn't been done. Each time we were cordial and I left his shop with the promise of, "about two weeks".
Nineteen, (that's 19 !), months into this ordeal I walked in feeling like it was good that I wasn't armed, and he was gone somewhere. His wife was there and asked what was up. Told her the story, she looked up the paperwork and said, " I'll take care of it."
Left thinking I'd never see the ram again. Ten days later I get a call and it's ready for pick up. Looks great. Took 19 months but looks great.
Man does good work, but too slow and too many excuses. Bet if the truth be told he was PO'd at me for bugging him and dragging his feet like your situation. Don't understand such juvenile antics from a "professional".
Hope your situation works out as well as mine did. Call his wife!
He doesn't have Art's phone number, and Art apparently is not answering his recent PM's or emails?
While its it would not be my fist cource of action to correct a problem, I'm guessing splattermatic is just trying what ever he can to force Art to send the items back..
Of course we don't know the otherside of the story...
what else should i do execpt get the law involved now ?
like i said guys and gals, it's not a super piece of wood, but it imy first. i have quite some money tied up in it, with the whittlin that was done, the trap, finish's, etc... how would you all like your first taken from you ?
a year is long enough, just return my property finished or not, in undamaged condition.
his lack on comments says one thing. and what else is the other side at this ?
it has come down to where, i've asked several times nicely to return my property, no answer's. now, yeah, to force his hand to crap or get off the pot.
oh, and airing the pm's, yep another member was sayin the same thing about a one sided deal here, and all the pm's should be posted.
Find me a smith that will install a trap and forend for the cost of a 25 caliber barrel blank that I'm pretty certain Splatter go from a died smith's estate.
Guessing Art was being rather nice and it also looks like Splatter didn't catch it.
hey art peck aka sitka deer, of achorage, ak. i sent you a stock to inlet a cartridge trap about a year ago. i paid for that service in full with a .25 caliber barrel blank. we also discussed a foreend tip and grip cap out of 2 of 4 materials to be done by you and paid with cash when completed. over this year we exchanged some pm's, you never did tell me what materials you were going to use, and never sent pics of the work you said was done.
the last time you replied to a pm was on 11/23/10, yeah, 4 months ago. at that time you said i pissed you off and you don't do good work when not thinking happy thoughts or something to that contect.
i see where you finally read my last pm to you, asking for my stuff back. i have asked several times in public threads for you to return my property, again no response from you.
you continue to post here and act like the grand pooh bah of stock work.
well, i have a different opinion of you, i think you are a THIEF.
again art peck, i am asking you to return my property.
you have had a year now to do a simple cartridge trap inlet, and as was agreed, a foreend tip out of ebony or african black wood, and a grip cap out of cape buff. horn or water buff. horn. either of which you have never told me.
now is time for all the members here to know you are a dishonest thief.
you said 4 months ago there were some problems, of which i do not understand,and it would take a little time to work out. that was 4 months ago, with no updates, replies, contacts, or returned phone call. yeah, that was me that left a message on your home phone.
art, I WANT MY PROPERTY BACK, NOW.
i can't get any clearer than that. enough, is enough, of your games or thievery. whichever you want to call it.
You're a [bleep]' liar, and a whiny b!tch to boot.
HANG ALL THE PM THREADS.
You know, the ones where Art told you specifically what was going to be used for the caps (that you claim he didn't).
All of them.
Hell, it took you 45 minutes to READ them all to me over the phone, and yet you claim no contact from Art. Hell, the PMs to/from me on this deal would cover at least a 30 minute conversation, and you drove me f'kin' nuts when all I was trying to do was settle you down on wtf was going on.
You're a [bleep]' liar.
Go ahead, call the local SOs up there and try to file for a theft claim, which you've threatened a couple times. The PMs you claim aren't there will cover Art's ass, and make you look like one.
And, add in the one where Art SPECIFICALLY said that the work, which will be done, won't cost you a dime.
Free work, and you still b!tch.
The recommendation still stands: don't EVER get anything custom from anyone else again.
Here's to hoping any/all custom 'smiths of any stripe pay close attention to your rantings, too... just in case you contact them, they can add a considerable "whiny-b!tch" premium to the cost. They'll need it, but it still won't be enough.
Harsh would have been giving the guys hands the same treatment..
It was harsh. Doing the guy's hands would be harsh too. I can think of some even harsher things, but this stuff is bad enough. Old-school, even, one might say. The way things were settled before PM's and emails and suchlike.
Worth saying that the only other mod I ever knew of here besides the owner, was Art. I liked his moderation as good as Rick's. This is a different situation though, and I'm just a bystander.
Edited to say I just gotta think there is some wild, wild misunderstanding or miscommunication involved here. I've always thought Art was standup and I have no reason to think any differently of Splattermatic. Hope it gets resolved to the satisfaction of both parties.
The suggestion was made then to hang all the PMs, and you refused to do so then.
You made false claims then, and when you let slip that you actually had more communication than what you first claimed, you backed off fast.
You're a damned liar, a whiny b!tch, you know where your stuff is (i.e., it hasn't been stolen), you have no expenses to pay for the work being done ("it won't cost you a dime"), and you start schit like this when you know what you're blathering is untrue.
You're doing a damned fine job of trying to slander a man's reputation, and perhaps a better one of doing in your own.
Good prior warning for other custom 'smiths (be that firearm, stock, or blade), though. So, please, continue...
every single pm, like you suggested in the other thread and on the phone, IS posted, i left nothing out.
it was offered free only in the last pm i received from him, 4 months ago as well as there's a weeks worth of work on my bench and yours in in there or something to that content.
a weeks worth of work, 4 months ago.
where is it then ?
it's not the point now, of having the work completed or how well it's done. i've asked several times for my property to be sent back, and no contact from him. where else do i turn ?
and as a matter of fact sean, i had the 280ai built by benchmark and they were very nice. ron, even called me, to tell me how things were going and asked if there were any changes before they went any further.
sean, your so full of yourself. i didn't say i had no contact and then let slip i did and backed off. i didn't want this to come to this and let it go away quietly hoping to regain my property.
i said in there, i had some contact until the i'm pissed at you, then nothing. please read.
Post the ones where you were whining to me over the same schit, and basically getting clarification from the EXACT same PMs you can't seem to decipher as to what he said and didn't say.
Basically, your stock was completely fubar as far as being "right" when it got to Art and he's reprofiling the damned thing to make it worth a f'k. Hard to unscrew a pooch, but he didn't screw it up in the first place. Trying to get all the lines right on a turd of a stock, ain't easy. And, it wouldn't be cheap if you had to pay for it.
Basically, the guy is reprofiling a POS stock into something you can be proud of, even when he knows all you're doing and going to do is this schit.
You could at least have the common f'kin' decency to stfu and take his FREE work to make that turd you sent him into something decent, and accept it as done right.
Of course, you can't do that, can you?
No matter what, if he sent it back now, you'd claim he butchered it (when, in fact, it was a POS to begin with); and he he gets it right, you're going to bitch and complain that it took too long and you only got it back via threats.
....You're doing a damned fine job of trying to slander a man's reputation,...
That first thread was pretty anonymous, didn't call anyone out, and got PLENTY of exposure (meaning Art must have seen it). No "slandering" or anything else.
It was also four months ago.
The very simple solution, at that point, back in November, would have been to simply return the stock, cut ties, and move on, all behind the scenes and unnamed, reputation intact.
Be rest assured FB that after 24 years of trial litigation, I can tell you without any equivocation there is always another side to the story. Emphasis on always!!
The thread title was inartfully crafted and inexcusable.
Maybe not in the OP opinion. He just wants his [bleep] back at this point. Pretty simple stuff.
==================
Calling someone a thief might be "pretty simple stuff" for those with simple minds. It's a actionable accusation.
Holding somebody's goods for an unreasonable time without explanation sucks, counselor. Simple mind and all......
Plenty of explanation, if the OP cared to read and comprehend.
Basically, the stock he sent Art was a POS; none of the lines were right. Art's been trying to fix it, make it right, and will do so. All free of charge.
Be rest assured FB that after 24 years of trial litigation, I can tell you without any equivocation there is always another side to the story. Emphasis on always!!
Up to the point of the last thread, I'd agree.
But after the last thread which was a couple months ago, there is zero excuse to still hold onto the man's property or account for why you think you are entitled to hold onto the man's property.
The burden has been on Sitka since November. Any ethical man would have either sent the stuff back and washed his hands of it or accounted for his side of the story before the forum where he was accused.
I'm sorry FB.I didn't realize you've been aware of everything which has transpired since November. Art may owe something more to the OP but he certainly owes you or the forum nothing.
Brings to memory too many past -- and one pending -- similar situation I've had with custom gun, and knife work. It always seems the wait is too long, the communication too slow, and doubts start creepin' in.
As of yet (fingers crossed), I've never been stung.
Part of the process for true custom work - never did understand why.
No commentary on either of the participants in the current situation, but just a general aside...this is why I seldom do business via mail, parcel post or the internet, etc. I like to talk to a guy I'm buying labor from or see the stuff I'm purchasing. Introducing time and distance into a situation is, IMO, a bad deal. Different people have different expectations, etc. If I buy something, right there and then, the only possibility is if it immediately goes bad and for some reason it is on the seller. Sometimes stuff just goes bad immediately and it is genuinely on the buyer...most get what I'm saying. I've bought and sold stuff a lot and I generally like to do it face-to-face. Saves a lot of stress and stress is a killer.
I'm sorry FB.I didn't realize you've been aware of everything which has transpired since November. Art may owe something more to the OP but he certainly owes you or the forum nothing.
No, he certainly owes nothing to you or I.
But anyone that would hold onto the stuff after being called out in November, is either dumb as a rock or dishonest.
Basically, the stock he sent Art was a POS; none of the lines were right. Art's been trying to fix it, make it right, and will do so. All free of charge.
He sure hasn't been trying very hard or it would have been done a long time ago. Art was posting over on the gunwriters forum last night so he's not "away" and I'd be pretty surprised if he wasn't aware of what's going on here.
After 10 years of reading Art's posts there is no way you will convince me he is a thief. I don't know the whole story only Art and Splatter do. If Art wants us to know I guess he will tell us. Too bad it had to come this.
Okay, here's my take on this whole clusterfock. Yes, it's been too long. Yes, he probably should have returned the stock by now. I don't believe two wrongs make a right, and if Sitka's sitting on the stock because he's upset, that's wrong. A craftsman is only as good as his reputation, and if he scars his reputation, there's gonna be lots of mac and cheese and ramen noodle suppers in his future. Vanimrod is someone I trust, and if he say's Art's trying to fix up someone else's mess, I believe him wholeheartedly.
Now to my primary thoughts on this matter. I just don't think this is the place to come for resolution to this issue. We are not the folks you should be communicating with-Art is. I understand your frustration, and realize this is probaly your last resort, but you run the risk of besmirching a man's reputation when there may still be a chance he's trying to resolve this.
At any rate, I do hope this works out for you in short order. Good luck to both you and Art in gettng this resolved.
If he's married, contact his wife. She may just get him in gear.
I took a ram to a highly regarded taxidermist and waited patiently during the 9 months I was told it would take. I called a couple of times and then started to visit. Each time I was given a story of why it hadn't been done. Each time we were cordial and I left his shop with the promise of, "about two weeks".
Nineteen, (that's 19 !), months into this ordeal I walked in feeling like it was good that I wasn't armed, and he was gone somewhere. His wife was there and asked what was up. Told her the story, she looked up the paperwork and said, " I'll take care of it."
Left thinking I'd never see the ram again. Ten days later I get a call and it's ready for pick up. Looks great. Took 19 months but looks great.
Man does good work, but too slow and too many excuses. Bet if the truth be told he was PO'd at me for bugging him and dragging his feet like your situation. Don't understand such juvenile antics from a "professional".
Hope your situation works out as well as mine did. Call his wife!
Real glad it worked out for you Seven_H. Real glad! Cringed as I read your story. After 12mos I'd have been demanding to have back the horns and cape! Certainly if all I was getting was excusses and runaround. A hefty chunk of change (on principle) automatically warrents the buyer "the right" to believe and even "feel" he's not being ripped off - EVER!
But something as irrepaceable as a sheep ..... congrats!
As usual, this thread will spawn into many different issue's,
But I fail to understand where a person who demands to have his property returned, still doesn't have it several months later.
Quite simply it's his property. It has nothing to do with cost or quality or length of time or personal messages.
I also don't mean to ruffle any feathers of our resident legal counsel, but the average lawyer would have filed papers months ago if this involved their personal property.
Simple, just pack up the stock and parts and get them shipped back to the owner.
Quote
No dog in the fight, but indeed this does seem to be a simple solution. Had that been done 4 months ago none of this would be transpiring.
A couple examples of short and sweet, no emotions, no picking sides, no accusations, no siding with "friends".
The two sides aren't going to be happy anyway, Art can cut his losses and avoid doing any further free work, Mark can get his stock back, and life goes on.
I have an almost identical situation going with another stockmaker I found on the Campfire, Claude Gatewood. He has a large chunk of instrument grade fiddle back maple (enough for two stocks). He has my deposit and refuses to return my wood. He did return my barreled action.
I won't bore you with all the emails and phone calls, suffice it to say; Never have any dealings with Claude, the Fraud, Gatewood.
All I want is my beautiful wood back, he can keep my deposit.
What I can't understand about these two situations is why the hell doesn't the supposed businessman simply return the stuff and be done with it?
Anyone who has been in business for any length of time will have unhappy customers. It is best to get these situations taken care of quickly and quietly. To let them rage on the internet, especially on a forum specifically serving your future customers, is just plain stupid.
Makes me wonder if these "businessmen" have any comprehension of how to run a successful business.
Sitka may be the best stockmaker in the world but you can BYSA I would never use him and that goes double for Claude the Fraud.
Sometimes when you get started into a job you never should of took on via good deed you almost have to finish it, at least to a point to give the owner back a semblance of what he brought you. I wouldn�t doubt that this is a position Art might be in and pissed at what he was given and that he got himself into this position. I can understand the OP�s frustration but will continue to think highly of Art regardless of how this turns out. As always I reserve the right to change my opinion.
I always hate to see threads like this. Especially when it involves members I admire. At this point, I only see a single side to the story ... and I hate rushing to judgement without all facts, and when others do so. What I do know is that Sitka Deer is rather generous with his time and knowledge on this forum. I agree with isaac on how this was handled. Publically calling out a man for a thief is strong language, although I can understand the frustration of scant communication and time involved. I hope there is still a way these two gentlemen can resolve this ... as gentlemen.
I've followed this from the first thread and I don't believe there is a satisfactory outcome for either party. If it were my stock, I would let it go and chalk it up to experience. There comes a time when the grief involved is no longer worth it. I've learned more expensive lessons than a few hundred dollars for a stock.
I expect that both parties have decided that there are some people whom they no longer wish to deal with.
I have been in business for many years and can assure everyone that when a customer is unhappy we will do just about anything to make him happy. I really don't care whose fault it is.
Nothing is more damaging to a business than someone badmouthing it to the public. I cannot understand why Sitka doesn't ship the stuff back. He has now had 10 pages of mostly negative comments. I doubt anyone who read this string would take a chance on doing business with him.
Sometimes when you get started into a job you never should of took on via good deed you almost have to finish it, at least to a point to give the owner back a semblance of what he brought you. I wouldn�t doubt that this is a position Art might be in and pissed at what he was given and that he got himself into this position. I can understand the OP�s frustration but will continue to think highly of Art regardless of how this turns out. As always I reserve the right to change my opinion.
I can understand the frustration of waitingggggggggg, I have a couple of rifles at the smith going on 14 months. One needs a new mag release, and polish the chamber on the other, the smith hates fixing them but loves to build them. I am almost temped to see if he will build me something, anything i can shoot, and he can keep the other two as payment....
How long should a person have to wait if it was a car that went in for a new tranny, if you did not have it back in less than a week most would throw a fit...
I cannot understand why Sitka doesn't ship the stuff back.
Precisely. Because you haven't heard his side.
But go ahead, make more comments about him. Better to open your mouth, and remove all doubt......
I am not making comments about his work, my comments are directed to his lack of business sense. Like I said he might be the best stockmaker in the world but if gets comments like have been posted here would anyone not personally familiar with him do business with him? I doubt it.
One can only assume by his lack of response that he has none. This is exactly the same behavior exhibited by Claude Gatewood in dealing with me.
I cannot understand why Sitka doesn't ship the stuff back.
Precisely. Because you haven't heard his side.
But go ahead, make more comments about him. Better to open your mouth, and remove all doubt......
I am not making comments about his work, my comments are directed to his lack of business sense. Like I said he might be the best stockmaker in the world but if gets comments like have been posted here would anyone not personally familiar with him do business with him? I doubt it.
One can only assume by his lack of response that he has none. This is exactly the same behavior exhibited by Claude Gatewood in dealing with me.
You already have. How many phone calls and e-mails and PMs does it take before a dude just says "f'k, leave me alone and let me fix this turd you sent me?"
Obviously, you found his limit. He told you exactly that, and you still can't fathom that the problem is you whining like a b!tch and driving the dude nuts. You want a stock that looks like schit, has all the lines FUBAR, needs to be reworked, and a cartridge trap installed on a turd? Or, do you want something that is worth putting on a "project several years in the making"?
You started off by saying he never told you what he was doing with several things. The facts, in the PMs, clearly state otherwise. When shown that, then you started whining about not getting pictures when you thought you should. Constant phone calls, PMs, e-mails for status checks would drive damned near anyone nuts... but you don't get it do you?
There's not one damned thing going on with that stock that you don't know, and haven't known, from the get go (except how or why it was a FUBAR from the beginning as it is), and the only thing you've done or are doing is exactly counter to the ONE damned thing the guy trying to fix it has asked you to do: leave him alone long enough to get the time to get it fixed right... and in the right frame of mind to do it (i.e., not pissed off at your whining - hard to concentrate on getting the POS stock right when you're like nothing more than for the owner to get bent).
Good Lord, you drove ME nuts whining about the damned project over the course of a myriad of PMs, phone calls, etc., and I ain't even doing the damned work.
Suffice to say, I DO know both sides of this one, and all it's done is increase my faith in Art's work and professionalism.
He's fixing a complete turd of a stock for you, and doing the work requested, FREE OF CHARGE, and as it should be done. Yet, all you can think to do is try to pester the guy constantly and whine like a schoolyard b!tch when he doesn't hand-hold you through the whole damned process.
It was inevitable that Art stepped on his thing with his golf shoes. The other issue here is a few of the whack jobs like VA, Steely and the loser who does good to pay his child support in Texas who would support the person in question if he was an Ax Murder caught on camera lol. People do things that for whatever reason are not right and in this case get called out for it. The little �click� that most of the troublemakers are a member of (just go and research threads as to who is the first to jump in and call someone a Phuc$#%) and it will be apparent who has anger/alcohol management issues. It does not matter what happened here the little �click� will continue to support unabated the person in question.
I have the popcorn out and am waiting for some egg to be on some faces of the people who are calling the OP a liar and much worse! Time will tell so bring it on boys this is fun!!
My intention had been to not respond in any way and this will be my only response, period. I will not respond again, positive or negative to any comments here.
Sean essentially stated my conflict...
My error: Touching chisel to wood. Someone was so emotional about the whole thing I thought I could fix it for him.
I built gauges and looked and thought it would fit (you can remove wood and/or metal to get there, so it must be possible... And it is. Then I cut; then I saw what else would be required beyond my original intentions. I was committed because I had cut the wood. That issue stays unchanged. Feeling badly about the situation and dealing with an emotional individual I told him I would take care of it, without any cost to him. That would be completely free.
When discussing it I was lied to repeatedly about who did the stock shaping. I thought it would be very bad form on my part to blame my error and my troubles on the work of another Campfire member. I now know the basis for that was false.
Realize there were a LOT of discussions that went on... Way too many... PMs virtually every day looking for an update... Very emotional PMs. I quickly tired of them and wished to be between any other two hard places.
When the repeated prompts turned to the nasty side, accusing me of having screwed up his stock, etc. I got more than pissed. How that could have been missed is beyond me, but so is every other important aspect of the whole issue. And there are a lot of those.
This is not directed at Splatt, BTW, but rather the folks that have been subjected to this and shown retsraint. And, thank you to those that did not assume they had the whole story.
Cutting completely to the chase: The notion I could damage this "Piece Of Work" is laughable. The notion I can do less than I set out to and get away without more emotional tirades is nil. If I do less it will be called "My Work" just the same. That is not going to happen. Doing work for free while extremely busy is one thing. Doing it for an ingrate is an entirely different thing.
The fact Splatt chose to call me a thief in a public forum while not giving all the facts is an issue I need to investigate further. I have also been advised that standing will depend in part on whether I had knowledge of the offense, and when. I am establishing that here.
I apologize to all those that wasted time on this. I thank those that did not assume the worst of me. There are plenty of details and I left out many because it is not anyone elses business and would only waste more time. Nothing in my position has changed, nor will it. Splatt will get more than he pays for. thanks art
I cannot understand why Sitka doesn't ship the stuff back.
Precisely. Because you haven't heard his side.
But go ahead, make more comments about him. Better to open your mouth, and remove all doubt......
I am not making comments about his work, my comments are directed to his lack of business sense. Like I said he might be the best stockmaker in the world but if gets comments like have been posted here would anyone not personally familiar with him do business with him? I doubt it.
One can only assume by his lack of response that he has none. This is exactly the same behavior exhibited by Claude Gatewood in dealing with me.
Claude was smart
Smart you say? Why? Is he "smart" to keep what is not his? Is that how you conduct business?
I would be surprised if Claude the Fraud is still in business. If he is a friend of yours would you please ask him to return my wood? Thank you.
Seriously, Spanky has been whining and crying about that wood to Gatewood for years.
After Spanky's brags about his personal wealth, and about just wanting the wood back or compensation, a suit would be easy if he has what he says he has.
Couple of phone calls, a retainer, a filing, and voila!
It was inevitable that Art stepped on his thing with his golf shoes. The other issue here is a few of the whack jobs like VA, Steely and the loser who does good to pay his child support in Texas who would support the person in question if he was an Ax Murder caught on camera lol. People do things that for whatever reason are not right and in this case get called out for it. The little �click� that most of the troublemakers are a member of (just go and research threads as to who is the first to jump in and call someone a Phuc$#%) and it will be apparent who has anger/alcohol management issues. It does not matter what happened here the little �click� will continue to support unabated the person in question.
I have the popcorn out and am waiting for some egg to be on some faces of the people who are calling the OP a liar and much worse! Time will tell so bring it on boys this is fun!!
No, some of us are just a little more savvy than to jump in without knowing the other side of the story. *hint*
You and everyone else knows that these small cases are not worth a lawsuit. That is exactly why these thieves can get away with this crap.
I could file a small claims suit in my local court and get a judgment against Claude the Fraud who lives in Ohio. How about I hire you to collect for me?
You and everyone else knows that these small cases are not worth a lawsuit. That is exactly why these thieves can get away with this crap.
I could file a small claims suit in my local court and get a judgment against Claude the Fraud who lives in Ohio. How about I hire you to collect for me?
their worth it if yah want something......ive got a lawyer on retainer just so i can [bleep] with my wifes ex when im having a bad day and need cheering up......some chit aint bout the money but unless your willing to do what needs to be done quit beotching about it.....
Oh, they are very much worth a suit, if the wood was of the grade you claim it was and you have a clear-cut case of theft as you say you do.
Not only do you get the cost of the blank back, plus damages and fees, but you should easily have enough for a criminal case... again, assuming you have all you say you have and it is as you say it is.
Not in Ohio, so collections (assuming I even did that) would not be in my jurisdiction.
Simply put, I think you like to piss and whine about it, and pitch it as you were robbed, but know full well that it isn't and wasn't as you claim. Otherwise, based upon your other posts about financial and legal matters, you'd have already sued.
You and everyone else knows that these small cases are not worth a lawsuit. That is exactly why these thieves can get away with this crap.
I could file a small claims suit in my local court and get a judgment against Claude the Fraud who lives in Ohio. How about I hire you to collect for me?
their worth it if yah want something......ive got a lawyer on retainer just so i can [bleep] with my wifes ex when im having a bad day and need cheering up......some chit aint bout the money but unless your willing to do what needs to be done quit beotching about it.....
Since this has now been aired for everyone to see, I just hope it gets resolved in a manner that lets everyone know how it's resolved. The last one of these situations left me in limbo as to the integrity of the smith, and until I know how he handled the situation, I will never trust him, or recommend him,. I don't like that because he may be a heck of a good guy and may have settled things quite satisfactorily.
Don't you have some "Ponzi Schemes" to sell to little old ladies who after your sterling financial advice will be eating Kat Fuud, or maybe an anger management class on your own and not one that is court ordered.
Don't you have some "Ponzi Schemes" to sell to little old ladies who after your sterling financial advice will be eating Kat Fuud, or maybe an anger management class on your own and not one that is court ordered.
Yep, pegged fairly well as to which piece of schit crawled back up the pipe.
Would anyone like to recommend an Ohio attorney? I can't see how my damages would be much more than $1,000.00 and I doubt any attorney would handle that small amount.
If anyone is friends with Claude maybe they could convince him to return my property.
This is not high on my list of priorities. Unlike some small people around here I don't keep an attorney on retainer to harass past wives.
Im just a dumbass cow farmer, readin all this emotion has given me a headache, think Ill go look for the wife's pamprin/midol/vaga-whatever and mix up a big dose for myself.
Well, Sitka deer's post sure brings the issue into crystal clear resolution to me. It's a response he had no obligation to make, nor was it any of my business. Nonetheless, I am glad he responded.
I don't want to spend $5,000.00 to get back $1,000.00. You can BYSA these thieves are well aware of the economics involved.
Have you done business with The Fraud?
ive spent $3000 to [bleep] with a guy ive gotten $20 out of so far.....if yah want the wood hire a lawyer or go bust the [bleep] door down and get it back
Sounds like he-said-she-said. Sure are a lot of artful experts here though.
=============
A good many dumbasses,too!
Don't be personally offended by thinking I was bashing your art appreciation teachings. I'm sure you're good at what you do. That's some important schit for kids to know.
Roger that, let me know if you need any info/help when the time comes.
Well, now that you mention it ...
He'll need someone to pick them up from the airport... and a place to stay... and a guide.... and someone to actually do the shooting.... and the gutting (you'll likely get a new crossbow or rifle out of that deal, though... and a knife)... the skinning.... the packing out... the drive back to the airport....
Oh, and a cuddly teddy bear and a blankie so he can sleep at night....
I don't want to spend $5,000.00 to get back $1,000.00. You can BYSA these thieves are well aware of the economics involved.
Have you done business with The Fraud?
ive spent $3000 to [bleep] with a guy ive gotten $20 out of so far.....if yah want the wood hire a lawyer or go bust the [bleep] door down and get it back
I am not dumb enough to do either, you seem to be.
I've hired many attorneys over the years and I know very well when not to waste a lot of money to gain little. The thieves also know this that is why they can get away with this crap. You will notice he did return my barreled action. I guess he not dumb enough to risk a firearms charge.
I read Sitka's response and it certainly sounds reasonable. However I still cannot understand why he didn't simply return the stuff and be done with it. This is damaging his business.
I don't want to spend $5,000.00 to get back $1,000.00. You can BYSA these thieves are well aware of the economics involved.
Have you done business with The Fraud?
ive spent $3000 to [bleep] with a guy ive gotten $20 out of so far.....if yah want the wood hire a lawyer or go bust the [bleep] door down and get it back
I am not dumb enough to do either, you seem to be.
I've hired many attorneys over the years and I know very well when not to waste a lot of money to gain little. The thieves also know this that is why they can get away with this crap. You will notice he did return my barreled action. I guess he not dumb enough to risk a firearms charge.
I read Sitka's response and it certainly sounds reasonable. However I still cannot understand why he didn't simply return the stuff and be done with it. This is damaging his business.
nah took the [bleep] chit for 7 years without saying a damn thing till he dug a hole to deep to get out of, then i cut my lawyer a check and said "sic'em".......all it would have took is him keeping his word to the girls just once out of the hundreds of lies and i woulda shrugged off the bullchit....
FWIW, I have a similar let me help you scenario... its a kudu head to mount. Guy gave me a form another guy butchered but expects me to use it. The hide was tanned God knows where, full of holes....
End result... I finally bought a GOOD cape and whenever I have spare time I"ll order a new form that isn't butchered and when he gets it, it'll be worthy of the time spent on it.
I feel for ya. And its things like this that irritate folks on either side.
Since the above kudu I have basically refused any welfare type work. He could not begin to pay me what the mount will be worth after trying to no avail to salvage the first attempt....
As far ruining business, hearing Arts side only makes me want to like wood stocked guns so I can give him some business...
[quote=Spanokopitas] I don't want to spend $5,000.00 to get back $1,000.00. You can BYSA these thieves are well aware of the economics involved.
Have you done business with The Fraud?
ive spent $3000 to [bleep] with a guy ive gotten $20 out of so far.....if yah want the wood hire a lawyer or go bust the [bleep] door down and get it back
I am not dumb enough to do either, you seem to be.
I've hired many attorneys over the years and I know very well when not to waste a lot of money to gain little. The thieves also know this that is why they can get away with this crap. You will notice he did return my barreled action. I guess he not dumb enough to risk a firearms charge.
I read Sitka's response and it certainly sounds reasonable. However I still cannot understand why he didn't simply return the stuff and be done with it. This is damaging his business.
nah took the [bleep] chit for 7 years without saying a damn thing till he dug a hole to deep to get out of, then i cut my lawyer a check and said "sic'em".......all it would have took is him keeping his word to the girls just once out of the hundreds of lies and i woulda shrugged off the bullchit.... [/quote
for some the accumulation of dollars is at the very top of their list as to what's important to them.
for others, the same is down the list of what they place value upon.
that you fall into the latter category surprises me not at all, rattler
that some don't get that, sadly doesn't surprise me either
Sounds like one of those lawyers who vetos undesirable prospective jurors with "preemptory" challenges.
(And, I assume, swears to uphold and defend the Constipation of the Uncited Slates.)
==============
About 4 years ago I posted something about one of my peremptory challenges and you were quick to point out that I was maybe one out of every ten lawyers who you saw get it right.
You can't expect non-litigation attorneys to focus on that one.
[quote=Bulletbutt]Since this has now been aired for everyone to see, I just hope it gets resolved in a manner that lets everyone know how it's resolved. The last one of these situations left me in limbo as to the integrity of the smith, and until I know how he handled the situation, I will never trust him, or recommend him,. I don't like that because he may be a heck of a good guy and may have settled things quite satisfactorily. [/quote
Don't worry how this is resolved. Art is a known quantity here, in the plus.
I don't want to spend $5,000.00 to get back $1,000.00. You can BYSA these thieves are well aware of the economics involved.
Have you done business with The Fraud?
ive spent $3000 to [bleep] with a guy ive gotten $20 out of so far.....if yah want the wood hire a lawyer or go bust the [bleep] door down and get it back
I am not dumb enough to do either, you seem to be.
I've hired many attorneys over the years and I know very well when not to waste a lot of money to gain little. The thieves also know this that is why they can get away with this crap. You will notice he did return my barreled action. I guess he not dumb enough to risk a firearms charge.
I read Sitka's response and it certainly sounds reasonable. However I still cannot understand why he didn't simply return the stuff and be done with it. This is damaging his business.
nah took the [bleep] chit for 7 years without saying a damn thing till he dug a hole to deep to get out of, then i cut my lawyer a check and said "sic'em".......all it would have took is him keeping his word to the girls just once out of the hundreds of lies and i woulda shrugged off the bullchit....
My only response to that is; Good on you.
My little snit with Claude the Fraud does not arise to the level of your problem. I'm not going to throw good money after bad. Maybe someday he will see the light and send me my wood. I'm not the only one he screwed.
It really doesn't matter who was right or wrong, or any of the details. I don't understand why Art doesn't just ship it back and wash his hands of this mess. Then they could both move on...
Rost: I also don't understand why you would eat the cost of a replacement cape and a form. Saying "no" to potential business is a smart move sometimes. I have a couple customers that I will not do future taxidermy work for. Learned that there are easier ways to make money than dealing with a dickhead. I had a customer that I did several mounts for, and everytime payment was due, he would try and short me $50. I now refuse to do anything for him, good riddance.
I don't know why I'm really responding to this but Splatter- I wouldn't have posted all of these PMs here either. I consider the phrase, "Private Messages," a "contract" of sorts.
I won't make any suggestions to Art because I don't have his side of the story but what I would suggest to you, and I'm not claiming any moral superiority here, is take the high road, chalk it off to experience, and forget about it.
At worst, if what you say about Art is true, you've made a much bigger mess of it, and not helped him (at least knowingly) or yourself at all; and if you are at least partly to all wrong, you've slandered him and reflected very, very poorly on yourself in the process.
Better to walk away before any wounds are made bigger. Some issues are more than just dollar amounts particularly within a community such as the 24HCF.
I don't know why I'm really responding to this but Splatter- I wouldn't have posted all of these PMs here either. I consider the phrase, "Private Messages," a "contract" of sorts.
I won't make any suggestions to Art because I don't have his side of the story but what I would suggest to you, and I'm not claiming any moral superiority here, is take the high road, chalk it off to experience, and forget about it.
At worst, if what you say about Art is true, you've made a much bigger mess of it, and not helped him (at least knowingly) or yourself at all; and if you are at least partly to all wrong, you've slandered him and reflected very, very poorly on yourself in the process.
Better to walk away before any wounds are made bigger. Some issues are more than just dollar amounts particularly within a community such as the 24HCF.
Sitka deer posted his side earlier in this thread. Go back a few pages and you'll find it.
I'm assuming it's because the stock is in the process of becoming something of value and would be worthless if shipped back in it's current repaired and refurbished state.
I sure wouldn't ask Doug Turnbull to return my stock half way into the job...and I'm actually paying for it.
I'm assuming it's because the stock is in the process of becoming something of value and would be worthless if shipped back in it's current repaired and refurbished state.
I sure wouldn't ask Doug Turnbull to return my stock half way into the job...and I'm actually paying for it.
Doesn't matter what state it is in. Sounds like Splatter doesn't care about the prepayment, he just wants his wood back. Easy solution, ten minutes with a box and some tape and the drama is over.
I'm assuming it's because the stock is in the process of becoming something of value and would be worthless if shipped back in it's current repaired and refurbished state.
I sure wouldn't ask Doug Turnbull to return my stock half way into the job...and I'm actually paying for it.
ive spent $3000 to [bleep] with a guy ive gotten $20 out of so far.....if yah want the wood hire a lawyer or go bust the [bleep] door down and get it back
I am not dumb enough to do either, you seem to be.
I've hired many attorneys over the years and I know very well when not to waste a lot of money to gain little. The thieves also know this that is why they can get away with this crap. You will notice he did return my barreled action. I guess he not dumb enough to risk a firearms charge.
I read Sitka's response and it certainly sounds reasonable. However I still cannot understand why he didn't simply return the stuff and be done with it. This is damaging his business.
nah took the [bleep] chit for 7 years without saying a damn thing till he dug a hole to deep to get out of, then i cut my lawyer a check and said "sic'em".......all it would have took is him keeping his word to the girls just once out of the hundreds of lies and i woulda shrugged off the bullchit....
My only response to that is; Good on you.
My little snit with Claude the Fraud does not arise to the level of your problem. I'm not going to throw good money after bad. Maybe someday he will see the light and send me my wood. I'm not the only one he screwed.
actually its pretty much the same.....either put up the cash to solve the problem or quit beotching......i was [bleep] over by a gunsmith on here but unless someone asks bout the [bleep] you dont see me whining bout it, hell havent seen a post in regards to that [bleep] in a number of years.....sucked it up took my loss and i dont beotch bout it cause i decided it wasnt worth the plane trip to Texas to put the rifle up his arse sideways.....
There's anudder fifteen minutes I ain't never gonna recoup, plus I ran outta popcorn part ways through this particular adaptation of War'n Over A Piece.
Glad SD finally responded. Good to "hear" both sides. Also glad most of the fidiots that felt compelled to chime-in, were already on ignore. ;O)
Have had my share of customer relations snafus over the years and they've taught me one thing: If my initial feeling is that the customer might could be a jackass...run the hell away and don't look back. So my glitches have thankfully been few and of short duration.
I read Sitka's response and it certainly sounds reasonable. However I still cannot understand why he didn't simply return the stuff and be done with it. This is damaging his business.
If he was going to return the stuff, he should have done it before touching the chisel to the stock. Art admitted that his mistake was starting the work in the first place. In doing so, he quickly discovered that installing the cartridge trap is going to take a whole lot more work than originally thought. The stock needs to be re-shaped & refinished in order to make for a professional looking installation.
If he "simply" returns the stuff now, he he'd be returning a stock with the work partially completed. That would reflect very poorly on Art, because no matter what condition the stock was delivered to Art, the incomplete work will be forever touted as "his" hack job. The only way out is for him to complete the installation and return stock in the condition he originally said he would. That is exactly what Art said he would do, and he went one step further and said he'd do it for free......hardly the actions of a thief.
As for the delay - do you work best when your wife nags you to do something, or do you procrastinate? When continually hounded, do you do your best work or do you just rush through it to get her off your ass? Now, for fun, change my reference of "wife" to "child" and watch a person's patience for nagging/whining drop exponentially.
I read Sitka's response and it certainly sounds reasonable. However I still cannot understand why he didn't simply return the stuff and be done with it. This is damaging his business.
If he was going to return the stuff, he should have done it before touching the chisel to the stock. Art admitted that his mistake was starting the work in the first place. In doing so, he quickly discovered that installing the cartridge trap is going to take a whole lot more work than originally thought. The stock needs to be re-shaped & refinished in order to make for a professional looking installation.
If he "simply" returns the stuff now, he he'd be returning a stock with the work partially completed. That would reflect very poorly on Art, because no matter what condition the stock was delivered to Art, the incomplete work will be forever touted as "his" hack job. The only way out is for him to complete the installation and return stock in the condition he originally said he would. That is exactly what Art said he would do, and he went one step further and said he'd do it for free......hardly the actions of a thief.
As for the delay - do you work best when your wife nags you to do something, or do you procrastinate? When continually hounded, do you do your best work or do you just rush through it to get her off your ass? Now, for fun, change my reference of "wife" to "child" and watch a person's patience for nagging/whining drop exponentially.
I'm assuming it's because the stock is in the process of becoming something of value and would be worthless if shipped back in it's current repaired and refurbished state.
I sure wouldn't ask Doug Turnbull to return my stock half way into the job...and I'm actually paying for it.
Unlike most here, I've actually seen the piece of wood in question. He's actually trying to make a '68 Shelby out of some popsicle sticks & a barn hinge.
I read Sitka's response and it certainly sounds reasonable. However I still cannot understand why he didn't simply return the stuff and be done with it. This is damaging his business.
If he was going to return the stuff, he should have done it before touching the chisel to the stock. Art admitted that his mistake was starting the work in the first place. In doing so, he quickly discovered that installing the cartridge trap is going to take a whole lot more work than originally thought. The stock needs to be re-shaped & refinished in order to make for a professional looking installation.
If he "simply" returns the stuff now, he he'd be returning a stock with the work partially completed. That would reflect very poorly on Art, because no matter what condition the stock was delivered to Art, the incomplete work will be forever touted as "his" hack job. The only way out is for him to complete the installation and return stock in the condition he originally said he would. That is exactly what Art said he would do, and he went one step further and said he'd do it for free......hardly the actions of a thief.
Agreed! Sitka being compared to a thief is like someone breaking and entering a house to vacuum and dust. No self respecting professional would do a half azzed job.
Agreed! Sitka being compared to a thief is like someone breaking and entering a house to vacuum and dust. No self respecting professional would do a half azzed job. ==============
It used to be that the concept of doing such wouldn't be beyond the comprehension of a good many folks. I was way off on that.
I don't know nothing about anything going on here,...but I've known Splattermatic for several years via another forum and he's universally considered a "good guy" by the membership there.
I've personally purchased a stock off of him, and he went to great lengths to describe every tiny fault on it, and if anything, exaggerrated its flaws far beyond their significance.
Lots of selling and trading goes on at the other forum, and if somebody does a bad deal, they get hammered pretty good for it.
I've never heard of any problem that anyone had with Splatt concerning a transaction.
I don't know nothing about anything going on here ==========
You should have stopped there.
The difference between me and you is,..you don't know [bleep] about it either,...but you're bending over backwards to stick your face in the middle of it.
I wouldn't have felt the need to do so if certain "notorious" forum members hadn't taken it upon themselves to interject their typical inflammatory crap into the conversation.
It really doesn't matter who was right or wrong, or any of the details. I don't understand why Art doesn't just ship it back and wash his hands of this mess. Then they could both move on...
Rost: I also don't understand why you would eat the cost of a replacement cape and a form. Saying "no" to potential business is a smart move sometimes. I have a couple customers that I will not do future taxidermy work for. Learned that there are easier ways to make money than dealing with a dickhead. I had a customer that I did several mounts for, and everytime payment was due, he would try and short me $50. I now refuse to do anything for him, good riddance.
Just one of those dumb things... I refused to do it with the junk he provided even though he said he didn't care how bad it looked. He never shot the thing. Bought a set of horns somewhere. Bought a cape somewhere else. I'll get the money back out of him as we trade some stuff out, but regardless I should have turned it down in the first place for sure. Rest assured I won't deal with him again because of what he provides. I"m just not in it what tiny bit I do now and then, to turn out junk. Want junk, hit McDonalds drive through.
He might not be a thief but he sure seems like a vindictive SOB.
Splatter keeps asking for his property back and gets flat out ignored and some of you have the audacity to tell him he should just forget about it and chalk it up to a bad deal.
He might not be a thief but he sure seems like a vindictive SOB.
Splatter keeps asking for his property back and gets flat out ignored and some of you have the audacity to tell him he should just forget about it and chalk it up to a bad deal.
...fuggin' BS.
except that splatter will beotch bout Arts [bleep] up work more than likely......Art seems to rather want to take the heat of keeping it and finishing the work than getting his name attached to chitty work that wasnt his fault.....can appreciate that.....even more so that the work is being done gratis.....
......Art seems to rather want to take the heat of keeping it and finishing the work than getting his name attached to chitty work that wasnt his fault.....can appreciate that.....even more so that the work is being done gratis.....
At this point, it really isn't his option to finish it. He has someone else's property and they want it back. Fugged up or not.
Art has gone out of his way to help me on several occasions and everytime his opinions have been spot on. He has never tried to make a profit off any advice that he has offered me or anyone else that I know of.
I deal with lots of folks on a daily basis and if someone is a thief it shows up pretty quickly. If Art was a crook I doubt that he would have anyone defending him let alone the number of guys stepping up to support him.
My God, since when did dicking with a piece of wood become such a big deal? People act like Art is restoring a 68 Shelby or something.
Snork!
After following this thing (and now regretting every minute I've wasted doing so), have come to the following corn-clusion:
Lack of simple communication between two otherwise reasonable and decent men over something involving money and time, can cause what was a simple, friendly matter into a ridonkulous farking feud spectacular. You both could've handled this better, gents. Emphasis on both. Points off from SM for posting PMs, and shame on SD for not just sending the damned thing back and washing his hands of it when things went wonky.
I hereby sentence you both to drinking warm beer for two nights in a row. OK, one. Domestic big label, though. In a can. Speaking of beer...
I don't know why I'm really responding to this but Splatter- I wouldn't have posted all of these PMs here either. I consider the phrase, "Private Messages," a "contract" of sorts.
I won't make any suggestions to Art because I don't have his side of the story but what I would suggest to you, and I'm not claiming any moral superiority here, is take the high road, chalk it off to experience, and forget about it.
At worst, if what you say about Art is true, you've made a much bigger mess of it, and not helped him (at least knowingly) or yourself at all; and if you are at least partly to all wrong, you've slandered him and reflected very, very poorly on yourself in the process.
Better to walk away before any wounds are made bigger. Some issues are more than just dollar amounts particularly within a community such as the 24HCF.
Sitka deer posted his side earlier in this thread. Go back a few pages and you'll find it.
Which brings me to a KG fun farm fact. I had tickets to see Ozzy's Diary of a Madman tour at the Nakano Sun Plaza in Tokyo, early 1980-ish. Randy Rhoades killed in plane wreck. Got refund. OK, so back to the original post, I think that sausages trump bacon, every time. But then I love Scrapple, or a side of corned beef hash off a hot grill, too...
Which brings me to a KG fun farm fact. I had tickets to see Ozzy's Diary of a Madman tour at the Nakano Sun Plaza in Tokyo, early 1980-ish. Randy Rhoades killed in plane wreck. Got refund. OK, so back to the original post, I think that sausages trump bacon, every time. But then I love Scrapple, or a side of corned beef hash off a hot grill, too...
Truth be told, I cried when I heard the news. But then at ten years old some slack can be extended to a boy for a senseless choice in his heroes. As an adult, it's, 'man, what a fooking dumbass. He was sitting on a winning lottery ticket, and was pretty good on the guitar, and threw it all away. Oh, well. So, what's for lunch?'.
Basically, it is seasoned,finely chopped Hog scraps-Snout, guts trimmings, floor sweepings - you name it.
Otherwise known as "Philadelphia Scrapple"..
It' mostly an eastern thing for Folks who cannot afford decent Sausage meat.
If "Soilent Green" were real, it would probably taste like Scrapple.
so basically like the old style sausage......cool will have to try it if i run across it.....
There is another component to it- cornmeal and or buckwheat flour etc. it's sort of an Amish thing.
It gives it sort of a gritty texture and makes the seasoning a bit funky. It's also very salty. Crispy fried in a thin patty smothered with Heinz ketchup- it does not suck.
My father loves the stuff and when we were kids, he and us boys used to blow through about a brick of the stuff at breakfast on a cold morning. We used to gross out my sister. We had her believing that gritty texture was the ground up Hog bones...
All those little piggies thrown whole into the meat grinder...
You already have. How many phone calls and e-mails and PMs does it take before a dude just says "f'k, leave me alone and let me fix this turd you sent me?
Ya I can see that, but he can't make that call on his own. I don't believe Art is a thief, no way, I just think he has a lot of pride and doesn't like letting a job beat him. I get he doesn't want to give up and quit, he probablly wants to finish the job he started, but once somebody asks for their property back. he needs to come to an agreement with the OP, not go silent for months no matter how tired of the OP he is.
Ya I can see that, but he can't make that call on his own. I don't believe Art is a thief, no way, I just think he has a lot of pride and doesn't like letting a job beat him. I get he doesn't want to give up and quit, he probablly wants to finish the job he started, but once somebody asks for their property back. he needs to come to an agreement with the OP, not go silent for months no matter how tired of the OP he is.
A simple PM that said, "Hey, there's a lot of problems with this stock, and I'm going to iron them out for you gratis. It might take me awhile, so please be paitent" would have kept this whole thing from happening.
Slather two pieces of warm rye toast with peanut butter. Put about five or six slices of cooked bacon on one piece and three or four slices of kosher dill on the other piece. Make into a sandwich and serve immediately.
Which brings me to a KG fun farm fact. I had tickets to see Ozzy's Diary of a Madman tour at the Nakano Sun Plaza in Tokyo, early 1980-ish. Randy Rhoades killed in plane wreck. Got refund. OK, so back to the original post, I think that sausages trump bacon, every time. But then I love Scrapple, or a side of corned beef hash off a hot grill, too...
I would have loved to see Randy playing for Ozzy!
Tim,
I did see that, in Albuquerque not long before the plane crash.
We were lit to the gills as per usual at a concert but Randy's was trancendentally awesome. Masterful.
Oh... let me add, Ozzie himself was God-awful, and his keyboard looked like something straight out of Spinal Tap. No bats or birds lost their heads, for which we were sorely disapointed.
The only two things I can say about this thread, is never, ever post PM's. That's just fighting like a beotch. The other is thread title. Those are actionable words IMHO
You already have. How many phone calls and e-mails and PMs does it take before a dude just says "f'k, leave me alone and let me fix this turd you sent me?
Ya I can see that, but he can't make that call on his own. I don't believe Art is a thief, no way, I just think he has a lot of pride and doesn't like letting a job beat him. I get he doesn't want to give up and quit, he probablly wants to finish the job he started, but once somebody asks for their property back. he needs to come to an agreement with the OP, not go silent for months no matter how tired of the OP he is.
I've stayed generally neutral on this one because I really truly see both sides.
In fact I'm sitting in my office right now waiting for a guy to drop off some tapes in an arcane format, for which I still have a working machine, and it's got that "no good deed..." thing written all over it!
BUT, what jumped out at me in the series of PM's was how many times it was "almost done". That's a beeeeg tactical mistake on the part of someone doing something for someone else. Don't say it's done in two weeks (or whatever) if it's not gonna be. Don't say there's pics on the way if there ain't, etc.
I've been trying to get a brain cell around the dueling obligations of "the stuff" here. On the one hand, it's clearly Splatter's stuff. On the other hand, when a job is partially done a tradesman is loathe to release it as such for the obvious reasons. Wierd. Ultimatly, it seems to me that the person who actually owns it, has a stake in it that trumps a tradesman's need to "protect the brand" so to speak. Talking ethically here. Legally I think it's very clear (it's Splatter's stuff).
The solution is obvious. Finish the stock. But that's not my business.
Even though I don't particularly like Art and he doesn't like me I do consider him to be a straight-up guy (in every capacity except as moderator, lol). I sure hope the two of them can get things squared away.
Which brings me to a KG fun farm fact. I had tickets to see Ozzy's Diary of a Madman tour at the Nakano Sun Plaza in Tokyo, early 1980-ish. Randy Rhoades killed in plane wreck. Got refund. OK, so back to the original post, I think that sausages trump bacon, every time. But then I love Scrapple, or a side of corned beef hash off a hot grill, too...
I would have loved to see Randy playing for Ozzy!
Tim,
I did see that, in Albuquerque not long before the plane crash.
We were lit to the gills as per usual at a concert but Randy's was trancendentally awesome. Masterful.
I bet it was a good show, even without the chemical enhancement on the part of the audience.
Which brings me to a KG fun farm fact. I had tickets to see Ozzy's Diary of a Madman tour at the Nakano Sun Plaza in Tokyo, early 1980-ish. Randy Rhoades killed in plane wreck. Got refund. OK, so back to the original post, I think that sausages trump bacon, every time. But then I love Scrapple, or a side of corned beef hash off a hot grill, too...
I would have loved to see Randy playing for Ozzy!
Tim,
I did see that, in Albuquerque not long before the plane crash.
We were lit to the gills as per usual at a concert but Randy's was trancendentally awesome. Masterful.
I bet it was a good show, even without the chemical enhancement on the part of the audience.
No chemistry involved, just plant matter <g>. Never was one for chemicals even back in the day.
Yeah... it was pretty cool, at least Rhoads was. As I said Ozzie was horrific. A parody. I'd seen Black Sabbath some years before that and it was like two different people! The very definition of bloated incoherant rock star.
Randy had amazing touch and clarity and played about as many harmonics as true notes... pretty cool.
Saw most of the big boys back in the day, except the Zep...
Slather two pieces of warm rye toast with peanut butter. Put about five or six slices of cooked bacon on one piece and three or four slices of kosher dill on the other piece. Make into a sandwich and serve immediately.
Don't knock it untill you've tried it.
I have the feeling that would either be absolutely fantastic, or absolutley disgusting. No inbetween.
I know a certain someone who was prone to make anchovy peanut butter sandwiches when he was in an, ahem, altered state of mind.
Ran into scrapple when I worked in D.C. and rather liked it. Not something you find in stores in rural Iowa. Ran across a recipe for it a couple of years ago and made some of my own. Wasn't bad.
Ran into scrapple when I worked in D.C. and rather liked it. Not something you find in stores in rural Iowa. Ran across a recipe for it a couple of years ago and made some of my own. Wasn't bad.
I'm not sure I'd want to know the details of that, John, but more power to you!
My mother's family is from PA, and I used to eat it when I visited my grandparents. Can't say that I remember it with great fondness, nor was it so bad. Just unremarkable, as best I can recall.
Only you are allowed to have an opinion I suppose....
If this is America, there must be a Freedom of Opinion Amendment somewhere!
===========
What are you blathering about now,Brent? Try to stay on topic and focus!
Simply inserting the phrase IMO doesn't automatically negate a cause of action for slander or libel. Does all this help you clear your confusion a bit or are you still in the mood to post nonsensical irrelevance?
I know Art. I've broken bread with him and his family. There is not a better man on these boards, or elsewhere. If he's guilty of anything it is trying to help someone out that doesn't realize it. Stupidity and sniveling run rampant among those that either want something for (or from) nothing, or are too ignorant to realize the gift granted. Not everyone has the capacity to appreciate gifts given.
Reminds me, I need to buy lunch for the accused. Thanks for the reminder!
What are you blathering about now,Brent? Try to stay on topic and focus!
Just you lawyers that seem to think you run the planet. I'd wager Splat is safe as a baby from any of your slander suits. But then wagering against you is probably a crime akin to taking candy from a baby.
Get out in the real world some. You need the experience.
... but like I keep saying, I've got sympathy both ways. I've gotten halfway into recording sessions where it became clear that the end result wasn't going to meet MY standards, due to the lack of quality of the raw material (the band). It's an ugly feeling. But you gotta just finish up, do your best, deep breath, move on...
Boil a hogs head till mush, remove bones, add corn meal and spice, pour into loaf pan and chill.
Slice and fry in yer skillet, serve wit eggs and fried taters.
Call cardiologist and tell him eff you!
Remove bones? Sheeit. Grind'nem bad boys up and toss 'em in for texture. If anyone's has haggis, it's similar in texture, spice content and flavor. And a GD righteous meat product to fix what ails a man. I grew up eating it with eggs, grilled, buttered english, home fries (potato chunks grilled to a golden brown in bacon fat), and a dab of maple syrup for the Scrapple. Step off, arteries; I'm blitzing!
I've had a hard time finding it out west, have someone on the east coast send you some.
OK, i officially declare this thread......
HIJACKED
I had firm instructions from a buddy in ID from his banker to make absolutely certain I did not arrive in Boise without at least 5 blocks of Scrapple. I could have jacked the price to silver levels, but as he's an east coast transplant, took pity and just said, "I'm going to ask a favor of you some day, paisan..."
Laffin'...I'd wager you don't know your ass from your elbow. What real world are you speaking of; the associate professor's lounge at whatever Community College you're part-timing at now?
I will let you know when I'm ready to leave the fake world of trial litigation for the real world of leotards and interpretive dance,though. I bet you're a hard grader!
Note to self: Do not do business with "sitka deer". Do not post PM's in threads. Learn how to swear and call people names so you can be a respected member of 24HourCampfire. Gain more respect on 24HourCampfire by calling "splatermatic" names because he wants his stuff back. It's OK to keep something that belongs to another person but it's not OK to get pissed and ask to have said property returned......I learned a lot from this thread. As "Big Stick" told me, take notes, and thank him later.
....Gain more respect on 24HourCampfire by calling "splatermatic" names because he wants his stuff back. It's OK to keep something that belongs to another person but it's not OK to get pissed and ask to have said property returned......I learned a lot from this thread....
No kidding.
Trust me, you're not the only one who sees the BS.
....Gain more respect on 24HourCampfire by calling "splatermatic" names because he wants his stuff back. It's OK to keep something that belongs to another person but it's not OK to get pissed and ask to have said property returned......I learned a lot from this thread....
No kidding.
Trust me, you're not the only one who sees the BS.
+ another 1
And you can get lessons in jurisprudence from the "expert" isaac too. This is really too good to be true.
What is kind of funny is that if what issy says is slanderous for Splat is true, then he must also worry that he has slandered me too... What a joker...
You're a confused little guy. I told you I would help you if you needed it so take advantage of your obvious need. But,I also understand your need to go running behind other's skirts,too.
On a recent "Dirty Jobs" episode Mike Rowe was at a Scrapple plant in PA. The meat they boiled down looked like a bunch of spare parts....ears, feet, snouts and fat. It was pretty nasty looking stuff.
You're a confused little guy. I told you I would help you if you needed it so take advantage of your obvious need. But,I also understand your need to go running behind other's skirts,too.
Whose skirts am I hiding behind? issy you really need to grow up a bit. I think I hear your mama calling, so run along now and you can play lawyer of the internet tomorrow.
Note to self: Do not do business with "sitka deer". Do not post PM's in threads. Learn how to swear and call people names so you can be a respected member of 24HourCampfire. Gain more respect on 24HourCampfire by calling "splatermatic" names because he wants his stuff back. It's OK to keep something that belongs to another person but it's not OK to get pissed and ask to have said property returned......I learned a lot from this thread. As "Big Stick" told me, take notes, and thank him later.
first off, i'd like to say thanks to art for chiming in here and explaining what's going on.
NOW, i know what the issue is. i am not a wood working person, and have no idea what i am looking at in a perfect stock and one that is jacked. that's why it went to him. i only asked for the trap to be inletted, and it has developed into i have a pos stock and it's barnwood, etc... i have said it's not an awesome piece of wood, it's going on a hunting rifle, and it is my first and looks good to me. a cnc machine made it, and a fellow member here, did a little recontouring, of which i had mentioned.
i guess i have an "over communicating" personality, one that may make some mad and enjoyed company to others.
as for posting pm's, i went by vanimrod's suggestions to post em.
now, art, thank you for taking on my pos stock and trying to make a sows ear into a silk purse. it went from an inlet for a trap, to you redoing the whole stock i take it ? i had no idea that was what you were doing. all i knew was you were inletting the trap, and doing a tip and cap, and there were some things no lining up.
all this could have been avoided if you would have just put aside the "i'm pissed at you" thing, and told me what was going on. i would have not "pestered" you, and let you do your thing, patiently awaiting the results of your work.
so with all this in the open now, and now knowing what is going on and art's name will forever be on this tock, and i will get it when completed. i will back off and let you do your thing, and i will not bring this anymore, and wait til you pm me for a shipping address.
i can see where you started it, and there were issues, and you don't want your name on a pos.
fine.
now, i am also man enough to say i did some things wrong, used the wrong words, and or terms.
i will eat crow, and raw at that. i am also man enough to appologize.
"i am sorry and do apologize for calling you a thief in my opinion, and for airing pm's, and anything i may have done to offend you or anyone else"
i tried to be a patient man, and let it roll off, but when it would come again, and again, i would also, not think happy thoughts.
the lack of communications for 4 months also added to it.
again all, i am sorry for calling out a man i thought who did me wrong, but was infact, trying to do me right.
it is something i regrett and am sorry for, but had no idea what was going on.
i am not a bad person, as many will attest to. sometimes we make mistakes, and i made one.
again, thank you art for trying to do me right, unbeknownst to me, and i do appreciate it.
amd i have learned from this also.
man, some of you have real bad mouths. vanimrod, your mother outta wash your mouth out with soap. there was no reason to start using that kind of language.
also, about this slander thing, isn't actually calling someone a homo, and other names more slanderous than voicing ones opinion of another.
everyone has an opinion, look at what we call our president ? look at all the this cartridge vs. that cartridge threads, are these not opinions ?
i used a wrong word, and am sorry for it. i should have titled it differently. but, alas what is done, is done, and i cannot take it back, but ask for forgiveness.
now, this is over, and let's get back to normal things..
Pa farm scrapple is just as you described. The home recipe was heavily laced with liver. Nasty stuff. Fried crisp with maple syrup it is eatable. One of the advantages of growing up was being old enough to say no and not have it forced on you.
Mother and Dad loved the stuff. I would come in the house and smell it cooking and would quietly close the door and escape.
....Gain more respect on 24HourCampfire by calling "splatermatic" names because he wants his stuff back. It's OK to keep something that belongs to another person but it's not OK to get pissed and ask to have said property returned......I learned a lot from this thread....
No kidding.
Trust me, you're not the only one who sees the BS.
+ another 1
And you can get lessons in jurisprudence from the "expert" isaac too. This is really too good to be true.
What is kind of funny is that if what issy says is slanderous for Splat is true, then he must also worry that he has slandered me too... What a joker...
You've no clue to what you're corresponding to, and being an acamedic and government lackie, I'm not surprised. Anyone that makes their claim to fame as a mouser has tales to tell, I'm sure. Idiot.
Learn how to swear and call people names so you can be a respected member of 24HourCampfire. Gain more respect on 24HourCampfire by calling "splatermatic" names because he wants his stuff back.
Crispy fried in a thin patty smothered with Heinz ketchup- it does not suck.
JHFC! Only a scum-sucking Communist SOB would put ketchup on good fried scrapple. Needs fer to be throwed aside a coupla eggs over easy and have some butter and maple syrup on it.
We ain't never gonna settle on that, but good to see that the principals have reached some sort of accord on the stock deal.
I like Heinz ketchup on burgers, venision meatloaf, fer making "quicky" hamburger BBQ and in some sauces and marinades. Other than that, it stays in the $#&% fridge.
One thing I miss about the ex-wife: One of my BILs and his family, made excellent scrapple and pork sausage every year.
She also slathered ketchup on everything. Don't miss that part.
first off, i'd like to say thanks to art for chiming in here and explaining what's going on.
NOW, i know what the issue is. i am not a wood working person, and have no idea what i am looking at in a perfect stock and one that is jacked. that's why it went to him. i only asked for the trap to be inletted, and it has developed into i have a pos stock and it's barnwood, etc... i have said it's not an awesome piece of wood, it's going on a hunting rifle, and it is my first and looks good to me. a cnc machine made it, and a fellow member here, did a little recontouring, of which i had mentioned.
i guess i have an "over communicating" personality, one that may make some mad and enjoyed company to others.
as for posting pm's, i went by vanimrod's suggestions to post em.
now, art, thank you for taking on my pos stock and trying to make a sows ear into a silk purse. it went from an inlet for a trap, to you redoing the whole stock i take it ? i had no idea that was what you were doing. all i knew was you were inletting the trap, and doing a tip and cap, and there were some things no lining up.
all this could have been avoided if you would have just put aside the "i'm pissed at you" thing, and told me what was going on. i would have not "pestered" you, and let you do your thing, patiently awaiting the results of your work.
so with all this in the open now, and now knowing what is going on and art's name will forever be on this tock, and i will get it when completed. i will back off and let you do your thing, and i will not bring this anymore, and wait til you pm me for a shipping address.
i can see where you started it, and there were issues, and you don't want your name on a pos.
fine.
now, i am also man enough to say i did some things wrong, used the wrong words, and or terms.
i will eat crow, and raw at that. i am also man enough to appologize.
"i am sorry and do apologize for calling you a thief in my opinion, and for airing pm's, and anything i may have done to offend you or anyone else"
i tried to be a patient man, and let it roll off, but when it would come again, and again, i would also, not think happy thoughts.
the lack of communications for 4 months also added to it.
again all, i am sorry for calling out a man i thought who did me wrong, but was infact, trying to do me right.
it is something i regrett and am sorry for, but had no idea what was going on.
i am not a bad person, as many will attest to. sometimes we make mistakes, and i made one.
again, thank you art for trying to do me right, unbeknownst to me, and i do appreciate it.
amd i have learned from this also.
man, some of you have real bad mouths. vanimrod, your mother outta wash your mouth out with soap. there was no reason to start using that kind of language.
also, about this slander thing, isn't actually calling someone a homo, and other names more slanderous than voicing ones opinion of another.
everyone has an opinion, look at what we call our president ? look at all the this cartridge vs. that cartridge threads, are these not opinions ?
i used a wrong word, and am sorry for it. i should have titled it differently. but, alas what is done, is done, and i cannot take it back, but ask for forgiveness.
now, this is over, and let's get back to normal things..
where are the babe pics anyways ?
I have had little interaction with Art over the years, but what I have had has always been fine. I've always thought he was a good guy. I have likewise, seen no bad behavior from you, Splattermatic. When taken with the fact that Bristoe said you are a fine fellow, I had to think this whole thing to be a huge misunderstanding. Looks like it was. Hope both parties can move on positively now.
Crispy fried in a thin patty smothered with Heinz ketchup- it does not suck.
JHFC! Only a scum-sucking Communist SOB would put ketchup on good fried scrapple. Needs fer to be throwed aside a coupla eggs over easy and have some butter and maple syrup on it.
Mumble, beech, groan.
Anyone who puts SYRUP on a meat dish is plain nuts.
"Yeah, I'll have a double cheeseburger with some maple syrup on it"..LOL
Not a damn thing wrong with Heinz Ketchup on Scrapple...
... but like I keep saying, I've got sympathy both ways. I've gotten halfway into recording sessions where it became clear that the end result wasn't going to meet MY standards, due to the lack of quality of the raw material (the band). It's an ugly feeling. But you gotta just finish up, do your best, deep breath, move on...
You are just tickled pink you found a 300 post thread that you aren't the brunt of.
Telling the TRUTH does cut one a bit of SLACK, though.
I don't think you've had to many "Best Days",......Mister, and doubt your sig line is backed up by anything but a cheap Jap Lathe......ans embarrassing work wrought with same.
first off, i'd like to say thanks to art for chiming in here and explaining what's going on.
NOW, i know what the issue is. i am not a wood working person, and have no idea what i am looking at in a perfect stock and one that is jacked. that's why it went to him. i only asked for the trap to be inletted, and it has developed into i have a pos stock and it's barnwood, etc... i have said it's not an awesome piece of wood, it's going on a hunting rifle, and it is my first and looks good to me. a cnc machine made it, and a fellow member here, did a little recontouring, of which i had mentioned.
i guess i have an "over communicating" personality, one that may make some mad and enjoyed company to others.
as for posting pm's, i went by vanimrod's suggestions to post em.
now, art, thank you for taking on my pos stock and trying to make a sows ear into a silk purse. it went from an inlet for a trap, to you redoing the whole stock i take it ? i had no idea that was what you were doing. all i knew was you were inletting the trap, and doing a tip and cap, and there were some things no lining up.
all this could have been avoided if you would have just put aside the "i'm pissed at you" thing, and told me what was going on. i would have not "pestered" you, and let you do your thing, patiently awaiting the results of your work.
so with all this in the open now, and now knowing what is going on and art's name will forever be on this tock, and i will get it when completed. i will back off and let you do your thing, and i will not bring this anymore, and wait til you pm me for a shipping address.
i can see where you started it, and there were issues, and you don't want your name on a pos.
fine.
now, i am also man enough to say i did some things wrong, used the wrong words, and or terms.
i will eat crow, and raw at that. i am also man enough to appologize.
"i am sorry and do apologize for calling you a thief in my opinion, and for airing pm's, and anything i may have done to offend you or anyone else"
i tried to be a patient man, and let it roll off, but when it would come again, and again, i would also, not think happy thoughts.
the lack of communications for 4 months also added to it.
again all, i am sorry for calling out a man i thought who did me wrong, but was infact, trying to do me right.
it is something i regrett and am sorry for, but had no idea what was going on.
i am not a bad person, as many will attest to. sometimes we make mistakes, and i made one.
again, thank you art for trying to do me right, unbeknownst to me, and i do appreciate it.
amd i have learned from this also.
man, some of you have real bad mouths. vanimrod, your mother outta wash your mouth out with soap. there was no reason to start using that kind of language.
also, about this slander thing, isn't actually calling someone a homo, and other names more slanderous than voicing ones opinion of another.
everyone has an opinion, look at what we call our president ? look at all the this cartridge vs. that cartridge threads, are these not opinions ?
i used a wrong word, and am sorry for it. i should have titled it differently. but, alas what is done, is done, and i cannot take it back, but ask for forgiveness.
now, this is over, and let's get back to normal things..
where are the babe pics anyways ?
Tried, along with others, to tell you time and again what was going on, as was indicated in the PMs and the phone calls you recited. Art hasn't said anything new to you, or about the situation; perhaps it's just finally gotten through your head.
As for language, there are times when descriptive language is appropriate and times when it is not. Perhaps you can decipher that from this thread, too.
Anyone who puts SYRUP on a meat dish is plain nuts.
Rumors of scrapple actually being a "meat dish" are known to be exaggerations at best and outright lies at worst. Not to be confused with wurst.
Scrapple is basically seasoned corn meal mush, that had been briefly exposed to an assortment of miniscule bits of hog parts and juices, left over from the butcherin'.
Which is why it's mo' betta mit der maple syrup.
And if ya ain't never had deer backstrap fillets marinated in maple syrup, brown sugar and soy sauce, then browned over a wood fahr...ya ain't really lived yet.
Anyone who puts SYRUP on a meat dish is plain nuts.
Rumors of scrapple actually being a "meat dish" are known to be exaggerations at best and outright lies at worst. Not to be confused with wurst.
Scrapple is basically seasoned corn meal mush, that had been briefly exposed to an assortment of miniscule bits of hog parts and juices, left over from the butcherin'.
Which is why it's mo' betta mit der maple syrup.
And if ya ain't never had deer backstrap fillets marinated in maple syrup, brown sugar and soy sauce, then browned over a wood fahr...ya ain't really lived yet.
Ah, no wonder my memories of scrapple at my grandparents home in PA are mercifully dim.
I do remember the syrup, now that it's been mentioned.
I would eat Ketchup on any meat or anything fried except for donuts, etc...
I don't use Ketchup for anything except meatloaf. Next time you are at a fast food joint, order your burger without ketchup and watch the show. Most likely the person you order from will first ask "you want extra Ketchup?", then the ones on the line will probably put ketchup on anyway. Sometimes they will try with another burger and sometimes they will wipe it off, and sometimes they will shake their heads and send it on. I have seen them try up to three times before the routine can be broken and they actually make one without ketchup. I like white gravy with my fries. miles
Hey guys, not trying to play moderator or anything, but I think everyone will be better off if we start a different thread about putting sauce on meat and just let this one die.
JHFC! Only a scum-sucking Communist SOB would put ketchup on good fried scrapple. Needs fer to be throwed aside a coupla eggs over easy and have some butter and maple syrup on it.
Mumble, beech, groan. [/quote]
Anyone who puts SYRUP on a meat dish is plain nuts.
"Yeah, I'll have a double cheeseburger with some maple syrup on it"..LOL
Not a damn thing wrong with Heinz Ketchup on Scrapple...
Hell, it's even PENNSYLVANIA Ketchup.. by gawd..
[/quote]
Heinz Ketchup.....NEVER.......Theresa Heinz-Kerry, Liberal wife of John Kerry (who married her for her money to finance his political aspirations. Huntz catsup in my household.
JHFC! Only a scum-sucking Communist SOB would put ketchup on good fried scrapple. Needs fer to be throwed aside a coupla eggs over easy and have some butter and maple syrup on it.
Mumble, beech, groan.
Anyone who puts SYRUP on a meat dish is plain nuts.
"Yeah, I'll have a double cheeseburger with some maple syrup on it"..LOL
Not a damn thing wrong with Heinz Ketchup on Scrapple...
Hell, it's even PENNSYLVANIA Ketchup.. by gawd..
[/quote]
Heinz Ketchup.....NEVER.......Theresa Heinz-Kerry, Liberal wife of John Kerry (who married her for her money to finance his political aspirations. Huntz catsup in my household.
[/quote]
Are you 100% positive you know where all the Huntz company profit goes? I sure as hell doubt it.
I don't like Kerry any more than you do, but Heinz is good Stuff. Huntz tastes like wallpaper paste in comparison.
Besides, I am sure a lot larger portion of Heinz gross revenues go to to regular folks (like Heinz workers) rather than Ms Heinz.
Besides, check who made your computer if you want to make politically motivated boycotts.
Anyone who puts SYRUP on a meat dish is plain nuts.
"Yeah, I'll have a double cheeseburger with some maple syrup on it"..LOL
Not a damn thing wrong with Heinz Ketchup on Scrapple...
Hell, it's even PENNSYLVANIA Ketchup.. by gawd..
Heinz Ketchup.....NEVER.......Theresa Heinz-Kerry, Liberal wife of John Kerry (who married her for her money to finance his political aspirations. Huntz catsup in my household.
Are you 100% positive you know where all the Huntz company profit goes? I sure as hell doubt it.
I don't like Kerry any more than you do, but Heinz is good Stuff. Huntz tastes like wallpaper paste in comparison.
Besides, I am sure a lot larger portion of Heinz gross revenues go to to regular folks (like Heinz workers) rather than Ms Heinz.
Besides, check who made your computer if you want to make politically motivated boycotts.
cant like that while Kerry was campaigning for prez he was touting saving jobs at home and quit sending them out of the country while his wife was moving the Heintz processing plant to Mexico.....we have Hunts at the house.....
I have seen them try up to three times before the routine can be broken and they actually make one without ketchup. I like white gravy with my fries. miles
Variation on the theme. The little rural choke'n puke my bud and I often ate at during deer season, had "ground beef steak" on the menu often. It was pretty tasty and I liked it with gravy and a side of fries.
One waitress could never quite figure out how I wanted it, if I told her gravy on the beef, none on the fries. One time she'd bring out my platter with gravy on everything. Next time, just gravy on the fries.
So I went to ordering the meat and fries, then demanding a bowl of gravy, so I could put the damn stuff precisely where I wanted it to be. She brough out enough gravy for the entire restaurant.
I don't know what the difference is, but I LOOOOOOVE the ketchup due north here in Alberta...its sweeter or something...but definitely better than you get in the states...
I don't know what the difference is, but I LOOOOOOVE the ketchup due north here in Alberta...its sweeter or something...but definitely better than you get in the states...
Quote
Kiss catsup goodbye. After 70 years of spelling the tomato condiment "catsup," Del Monte has kowtowed to "ketchup."
Del Monte is now applying the K-word on bottles moving through its plants in Modesto, Calif., and New Brunswick, N.J. Gradually, the K-word bottles are replacing the C-word bottles on grocery store shelves around the nation. And by early 1989, bottles of Del Monte catsup will be kaput.
By moving into the K-column, Del Monte, which has about 10 percent of the nation's ketchup business, has accepted the spelling used by Heinz and Hunt's, the nation's key ketchup makers.
The move is being made, says Del Monte's Donna Higgins, to accommodate �
Just as there are no cookies except chocolate chip cookies, there is no ketchup (or catsup or cat soup or whatever) other than Heinz. These are two of the items that were carved on the back of the Ten Commandments, which Moses failed to notice. (Another is that football pants are white.) I would hope that those who have disputed these facts in the past will(for the sake of their souls) accept them as truth now that the source for them has been revealed.
I have never met Sitka or Splattermatic. I will say this without reservation. Both of these men have gone out of their way to help me. I have close friends that do not like each other and they are still my friends. Egos and emotion sometime interfere with logic even with good guys. The End.
I don't know when the word catsup came along, but ketchup is old, old, old and most likely original.
from the OED �
Chinese (Amoy dial.) k�echiap or k�-tsiap brine of pickled fish or shell-fish (Douglas Chinese Dict. 46/1, 242/1). Malay kēchap (in Du. spelling ketjap), which has been claimed as the original source (Scott Malayan Wds. in English 64�67), may be from Chinese. � A sauce made from the juice of mushrooms, walnuts, tomatoes, etc., and used as a condiment with meat, fish, or the like. � ���1711 � "Soy comes in Tubbs from Jappan, and the best Ketchup from Tonquin; yet good of both sorts are made and sold very cheap in China."
The OED lists catsup (like catchup, as it's also heard) as merely a substitute for ketchup. No comment re provenan�e.
Sure would like to know what makes Canadian ketchup tastier. My late friend Bullwnkl spoke very highly of it and was going to send me some but died before he could get around to it.
I love the US stuff, especially with onion and cheese. Have been known to "inhale" onion-cheese-ketchup sandwiches.
Me neither & never will, but if Splattermatic request to have his property returned NOW. Then it should be returned. Over a year!....What a '[bleep] joke.
Originally Posted by okok
The OP wants his property back, at what point does it become theft?
Basically, your stock was completely fubar as far as being "right" when it got to Art
Trying to get all the lines right on a turd of a stock, ain't easy.
Basically, the guy is reprofiling a POS stock
that turd you sent him
(when, in fact, it was a POS to begin with)
Seems to me Art sent him a pm, right after he recieved the stock, saying everything looked fine, and it was a fast, easy job. Everything lined up, and would work, no problem.
If it was so [bleep] up the day Art recieved it, he should have just packaged it up that day, and sent it back. But he told splatter it was good to go.
I have never met Sitka or Splattermatic. I will say this without reservation. Both of these men have gone out of their way to help me. I have close friends that do not like each other and they are still my friends. Egos and emotion sometime interfere with logic even with good guys. The End.
It was aired out. He's a thief. Admitted to keeping my stock, and cartridge trap in public here, so he's a thief. Never returned it, or compensated me for keeping it all. He's a pos, and I hope he catches the virus.
It was aired out. He's a thief. Admitted to keeping my stock, and cartridge trap in public here, so he's a thief. Never returned it, or compensated me for keeping it all. He's a pos, and I hope he catches the virus.
Well then why the hell didn't you contact Anchorage PD and have his ass hauled off to jail? I mean, the way you laid it out, it must have been cut and dried. Easy peasy. So why isn't Art in the slammer? Inquiring minds would like to know.
I was just here reading, and saw it. I dropped it. Wrote it off. I dont care anymore. Got a new stock carved up, and got it the way I wanted. I'm done. I wont post again.
This thread is crazy. Get resurrected after 9 years and 2 minutes later the OP replies.
And minutes later you replied,
What's your point?
Ya, I have know idea who splattermatic is, but I notice Sitka dummy rolls around here with his typical arrogant know it all bullshiit. Not much worse than a thief in my book.
This does not surprise me at all about SitkaDeer. He knows it all and if you don't believe me, ask him. He arm wrestled jesus and beat him 2 out of 3 times.
Most likely what happen was his ego got the best of him and he broke the OP's stock. Most likely he was drunk while it happened. Instead of fessing up he just ignores it. Sitka deer is a typical democrat and doesn't see the problem with this.
Pathetic that you took the time to drag this up, man your life must be boring.
Actually it's not if look at other sub forums. Lots of new members in the last 9 years, should be privy to such info. Thanks for worrying about my pathetic life though...😁😀😎
Yep and here you be, typical of Washingtonians? I think not
oh the bigstick fanboy speaks... After hunting Canada numerous times, I can say you're not the typical Canadian, never met a cuunt up there, but hey, here you are! Kudos?
Letting Art off is what pusscakes would do - let's hear from him about the stock !!
Why didn't you send it back ? No matter how mad - send it back - go ahead and demand return shipping i'll send you the money ... Where's the mans stock ?????
I was just here reading, and saw it. I dropped it. Wrote it off. I dont care anymore. Got a new stock carved up, and got it the way I wanted. I'm done. I wont post again.
Why not? If he's a thief, the WORLD needs to know.. lol.
"Know it all".....chuckle. Remember well going round and round with S_D over a fullcurl Dall ram I killed and posted pictures of. Perfectly legal 360* sheep plugged by AK F&G, (looks identical to the ram that F&G uses for their 360* 'legal sheep' tutorial) one of several I killed as an Alaskan. That same ram didn't pass muster with S_D and he bashed me here ad nauseaum as an unethical hunter.
I quickly realized the guy was a legend in his own mind and never gave him another thought.
That stolen stock should have been returned nine years ago and you guys defending the thief are shameful pr!cks!
Letting Art off is what pusscakes would do - let's hear from him about the stock !!
Why didn't you send it back ? No matter how mad - send it back - go ahead and demand return shipping i'll send you the money ... Where's the mans stock ?????
It was aired out. He's a thief. Admitted to keeping my stock, and cartridge trap in public here, so he's a thief. Never returned it, or compensated me for keeping it all. He's a pos, and I hope he catches the virus.
I put a reminder to bump this tread weekly until the splat gets his property back or is justly compensated.
I'm glad we have something to talk about instead of the Chinese virus. That's getting old. Maybe start a poll? Who's for Splatter vs. who's for Sitka. I wasn't here in 2009 so it would be informative.
"Know it all".....chuckle. Remember well going round and round with S_D over a fullcurl Dall ram I killed and posted pictures of. Perfectly legal 360* sheep plugged by AK F&G, (looks identical to the ram that F&G uses for their 360* 'legal sheep' tutorial) one of several I killed as an Alaskan. That same ram didn't pass muster with S_D and he bashed me here ad nauseaum as an unethical hunter.
I quickly realized the guy was a legend in his own mind and never gave him another thought.
That stolen stock should have been returned nine years ago and you guys defending the thief are shameful pr!cks!
Thanks Judman, for bringing this back up and thanks to Splattermatic for his input. I just thought the stock had finally been returned since it hadn't been mentioned for so long.
Art, why don't you just return Splattermatic's property?
I can also say splattermatic good dude, bought a barrel off him. My bud needed it for a build. No bull chit kind of guy, so have no idea why he’s getting bent over the barrel.. well I know why..
79S made a post week or so ago about schitt driving the pony also.
Lol!!!
Wo leave me out of this one.. But Sitka deer is the smartest man on the internet ask him he will tell you..
Come on man .... Own it. You know what you alluded too in that post. The gist of it was in my cease and desist also several yrs back.
SD is untouchable man. Many of us know it.
LOL!!!
Cough cough oh man I got the virus, when I’m feeling better I will post what I know.. grandma is that you?? Jesus what you doing here??? I will be honest I have no idea what I post half the time..
79S made a post week or so ago about schitt driving the pony also.
Lol!!!
Wo leave me out of this one.. But Sitka deer is the smartest man on the internet ask him he will tell you..
Come on man .... Own it. You know what you alluded too in that post. The gist of it was in my cease and desist also several yrs back.
SD is untouchable man. Many of us know it.
LOL!!!
Cough cough oh man I got the virus, when I’m feeling better I will post what I know.. grandma is that you?? Jesus what you doing here??? I will be honest I have no idea what I post half the time..
2 of the actors in this clip are from CA and AK. They didnt have ta act very much. Fit naturally into character
I had a commercial gun maker string me along with lies & deceit for 16 years. One night it occurred to me that him being an ATF licensed maker was my Ace in the hole. I wrote him matter of factly & told him I would rat him out to the ATF for stealing my gun. It was on my doorstep the following week. I then sold it for $150 more than I had in it.
I have never complimented another man's wood and I have no plans to do so in the future.
The size of a man's wood should never be a sentence starter, but if a man has a really quality piece of wood with great grain, a compliment is always in order,
"Dude nice wood " just like you were showing yours off in public !
Has anyone alerted Sitka Deer that his integrity is again being called into question?
I reported this post to Rick. I'm trying to work out a hostage swap with Deflave for Sitka deer. Trying to locate a bridge somewhere in the middle of nowhere. Apparently that's where these sorts of things normally take place. Need a couple guys to back me up with automatic weapons and an old sedan of some sort. Ray Bans would be a plus.
Edit to add: A gangster looking Mexican would be cool. Wonder if STX is back from fishing? A sombrero and a bandolier full of 12ga would be pretty damn intimidating.
Has anyone alerted Sitka Deer that his integrity is again being called into question?
I reported this post to Rick. I'm trying to work out a hostage swap with Deflave for Sitka deer. Trying to locate a bridge somewhere in the middle of nowhere. Apparently that's where these sorts of things normally take place. Need a couple guys to back me up with automatic weapons and an old sedan of some sort. Ray Bans would be a plus.
I'm in Jack, I am just the type of shady character you need.... I don't have a tommy gun or a sedan though. I do have an AR14 and a truck though....
Has anyone alerted Sitka Deer that his integrity is again being called into question?
I reported this post to Rick. I'm trying to work out a hostage swap with Deflave for Sitka deer. Trying to locate a bridge somewhere in the middle of nowhere. Apparently that's where these sorts of things normally take place. Need a couple guys to back me up with automatic weapons and an old sedan of some sort. Ray Bans would be a plus.
I'm in Jack, I am just the type of shady character you need.... I don't have a tommy gun or a sedan though. I do have an AR14 and a truck though....
AR14's are illegal now, I wouldn't broadcast that Fubar. You don't happen to own a sombrero do you?
Has anyone alerted Sitka Deer that his integrity is again being called into question?
I reported this post to Rick. I'm trying to work out a hostage swap with Deflave for Sitka deer. Trying to locate a bridge somewhere in the middle of nowhere. Apparently that's where these sorts of things normally take place. Need a couple guys to back me up with automatic weapons and an old sedan of some sort. Ray Bans would be a plus.
I'm in Jack, I am just the type of shady character you need.... I don't have a tommy gun or a sedan though. I do have an AR14 and a truck though....
And to think, a few years back I was going to self quarantine from this forum..
Just look in on the Ask the Gunwriters, Single Shots, maybe the basement............but this place...................yep I was almost ready to ask Rick what it would take to get banned.
Has anyone alerted Sitka Deer that his integrity is again being called into question?
I reported this post to Rick. I'm trying to work out a hostage swap with Deflave for Sitka deer. Trying to locate a bridge somewhere in the middle of nowhere. Apparently that's where these sorts of things normally take place. Need a couple guys to back me up with automatic weapons and an old sedan of some sort. Ray Bans would be a plus.
I'm in Jack, I am just the type of shady character you need.... I don't have a tommy gun or a sedan though. I do have an AR14 and a truck though....
Has anyone alerted Sitka Deer that his integrity is again being called into question?
I reported this post to Rick. I'm trying to work out a hostage swap with Deflave for Sitka deer. Trying to locate a bridge somewhere in the middle of nowhere. Apparently that's where these sorts of things normally take place. Need a couple guys to back me up with automatic weapons and an old sedan of some sort. Ray Bans would be a plus.
I'm in Jack, I am just the type of shady character you need.... I don't have a tommy gun or a sedan though. I do have an AR14 and a truck though....
Has anyone alerted Sitka Deer that his integrity is again being called into question?
I reported this post to Rick. I'm trying to work out a hostage swap with Deflave for Sitka deer. Trying to locate a bridge somewhere in the middle of nowhere. Apparently that's where these sorts of things normally take place. Need a couple guys to back me up with automatic weapons and an old sedan of some sort. Ray Bans would be a plus.
Edit to add: A gangster looking Mexican would be cool. Wonder if STX is back from fishing? A sombrero and a bandolier full of 12ga would be pretty damn intimidating.
Has anyone alerted Sitka Deer that his integrity is again being called into question?
I reported this post to Rick. I'm trying to work out a hostage swap with Deflave for Sitka deer. Trying to locate a bridge somewhere in the middle of nowhere. Apparently that's where these sorts of things normally take place. Need a couple guys to back me up with automatic weapons and an old sedan of some sort. Ray Bans would be a plus.
I'm in Jack, I am just the type of shady character you need.... I don't have a tommy gun or a sedan though. I do have an AR14 and a truck though....
Has anyone alerted Sitka Deer that his integrity is again being called into question?
I reported this post to Rick. I'm trying to work out a hostage swap with Deflave for Sitka deer. Trying to locate a bridge somewhere in the middle of nowhere. Apparently that's where these sorts of things normally take place. Need a couple guys to back me up with automatic weapons and an old sedan of some sort. Ray Bans would be a plus.
I'm in Jack, I am just the type of shady character you need.... I don't have a tommy gun or a sedan though. I do have an AR14 and a truck though....
I have never complimented another man's wood and I have no plans to do so in the future.
The size of a man's wood should never be a sentence starter, but if a man has a really quality piece of wood with great grain, a compliment is always in order,
"Dude nice wood " just like you were showing yours off in public !
Has anyone alerted Sitka Deer that his integrity is again being called into question?
I reported this post to Rick. I'm trying to work out a hostage swap with Deflave for Sitka deer. Trying to locate a bridge somewhere in the middle of nowhere. Apparently that's where these sorts of things normally take place. Need a couple guys to back me up with automatic weapons and an old sedan of some sort. Ray Bans would be a plus.
Edit to add: A gangster looking Mexican would be cool. Wonder if STX is back from fishing? A sombrero and a bandolier full of 12ga would be pretty damn intimidating.
Letting Art off is what pusscakes would do - let's hear from him about the stock !!
Why didn't you send it back ? No matter how mad - send it back - go ahead and demand return shipping i'll send you the money ... Where's the mans stock ?????
And if the stock got screwed up, then pay up.
He doesn't have to ship it back to Splatter. Simply tell me when to pick it up, I will and I can fly it home with me on visits to TX and manage easily enough to get it to Splatter.
I have no beef in this personally but am sure willing to grab the stock and get it south free of charge. I"m in Anchorage area more than a few times a year. And my boss lives just outside and his parents live close to our place in TX so its EASY EASY EASY to get it back south.
I believe y'all are overlooking a very important point. Ranges that allow pant-less members are very difficult to find. Believe me, I've looked.
What if it's not expressly forbidden in the range bylaws/rules?
Could a case be made in court that proper attire was not specified, and especially if the range is a private, paid membership range and not a State operated one, therefor no "public indecency" occurred.
Show up with no pants someday and see what happens..............you just might be surprised.
I believe y'all are overlooking a very important point. Ranges that allow pant-less members are very difficult to find. Believe me, I've looked.
What if it's not expressly forbidden in the range bylaws/rules?
Could a case be made in court that proper attire was not specified, and especially if the range is a private, paid membership range and not a State operated one, therefor no "public indecency" occurred.
Show up with no pants someday and see what happens..............you just might be surprised.
Geno
I bet there is lary a word, about assless chaps in their bylaws !
This thread means nothing unless sitka deer posts his side of the story.
Oh he has posted plenty in the past regarding this subject....... he was pretty much an [bleep] about it
I've seen him post about it, but have never seen him explain why he kept Splattermatic's stock. I'd sure like to hear it.
He never said flat out why he kept it, just beat around the bush, makes me think his reason for keeping it would not hold up in the court of public opinion and he knows it.
I looked at his info - he's went on a posting diet per his usual .
Your name is on the front page and you don't have word to say to defend yourself when being called a crook .? OH but splattermatic is the bad guy to some of the goofballs here -- yeah ....
This reminds of a deal that went south when I sent off for a Sako about 25 years ago. The scumbag got my money but he didn't have the rifle. He gave me every excuse in the book. The phuged up part was that he was a pretty well known collector of Sakos. This is pre interweb and I did a lot of buying and selling on Gunlist. So did he.
Well, I hounded his ass night and day. His wife answered the phone one day and I explained what was going on. Her response was "I don't know why he does that"!
I decided that I was going to make the 500 mile drive to pay him a visit. My wife convinced to me to hold off.
I contacted my Attorney General office and sent them all the receipts, the Gunlist ad, etc. They said they would send him an official letter.
In the meantime, I made a complaint to gunlist (they would black ball you from taking out ads) and contacted a few folks that used to be in the Sako Collectors Association. A few knew him.
Well, low and behold, the scumbag returned all of my money after getting the letter from mu state's Attourney General Office. Having an FFL helped my case too.
I am glad I didn't drive to see him because I know things would have gotten ugly and it's not the hill I want to die on.
This reminds of a deal that went south when I sent off for a Sako about 25 years ago. The scumbag got my money but he didn't have the rifle. He gave me every excuse in the book. The phuged up part was that he was a pretty well known collector of Sakos. This is pre interweb and I did a lot of buying and selling on Gunlist. So did he.
Well, I hounded his ass night and day. His wife answered the phone one day and I explained what was going on. Her response was "I don't know why he does that"!
I decided that I was going to make the 500 mile drive to pay him a visit. My wife convinced to me to hold off.
I contacted my Attorney General office and sent them all the receipts, the Gunlist ad, etc. They said they would send him an official letter.
In the meantime, I made a complaint to gunlist (they would black ball you from taking out ads) and contacted a few folks that used to be in the Sako Collectors Association. A few knew him.
Well, low and behold, the scumbag returned all of my money after getting the letter from mu state's Attourney General Office. Having an FFL helped my case too.
I am glad I didn't drive to see him because I know things would have gotten ugly and it's not the hill I want to die on.
This reminds of a deal that went south when I sent off for a Sako about 25 years ago. The scumbag got my money but he didn't have the rifle. He gave me every excuse in the book. The phuged up part was that he was a pretty well known collector of Sakos. This is pre interweb and I did a lot of buying and selling on Gunlist. So did he.
Well, I hounded his ass night and day. His wife answered the phone one day and I explained what was going on. Her response was "I don't know why he does that"!
I decided that I was going to make the 500 mile drive to pay him a visit. My wife convinced to me to hold off.
I contacted my Attorney General office and sent them all the receipts, the Gunlist ad, etc. They said they would send him an official letter.
In the meantime, I made a complaint to gunlist (they would black ball you from taking out ads) and contacted a few folks that used to be in the Sako Collectors Association. A few knew him.
Well, low and behold, the scumbag returned all of my money after getting the letter from mu state's Attourney General Office. Having an FFL helped my case too.
I am glad I didn't drive to see him because I know things would have gotten ugly and it's not the hill I want to die on.
Mims Reed?
Mims was one of the folks I contacted to warn others. He WAS NOT the scumbag. Mims was a good fellow.
I looked at his info - he's went on a posting diet per his usual .
Your name is on the front page and you don't have word to say to defend yourself when being called a crook .? OH but splattermatic is the bad guy to some of the goofballs here -- yeah ....
Guys like him have sock puppets for when shît gets hot. He’s watching this thread every hour or so.
He’ll wait a couple weeks, and then one day someone will post something about “what type varnish should I use on this reloading bench”
And he’ll pop out like Punxsutawney Phil, eager to interject his FKIA 2-bit condescendingly toned advice.
He’ll wait a couple weeks, and then one day someone will post something about “what type varnish should I use on this reloading bench”
And he’ll pop out like Punxsutawney Phil, eager to interject his FKIA 2-bit condescendingly toned advice.
Even better is if someone would just make a post about their FFL wanting a driver license copy from a private seller. He'll post on it in 10 minutes or less.
I just can't believe how many here go to crowded public ranges to shoot. What a PITA that must be. Mostly we just throw sandbags on our hoods and commence to shooting out on State land somewhere around these parts. That's only when I need to shoot at longer distance than the 65 yards I have off my back porch though. I do belong to the Sportsmans club that's three miles down the road and shoot there occasionally but unless you go the weekend before deer season there's rarely anybody else there.
If he didn't get his stuff why would he let it go?
It's been 9 years now, do you think he's getting the stock back? You can only beat a dead horse for so long before there's nothing left to beat.
Just a stain in the road
Well if splattermatic hasn't got his stock back in 9 years despite asking for it repeatedly then Art Peck is WITHOUT A DOUBT a thief. Of course anybody who isn't a f.ucking retard already knew that long ago.
I've heard said, that the boy next door who will steal eggs from your chicken coop, will grow up to be the man who will steal your truck, a thief being just that, a thief !
In this case I think we know who the egg thief is ! I would also think buying eggs would be cheaper in the long run.....
This whole problem could be easily resolved. All Sitka needs to do a fund a gift certificate to Bass Pro for the cost of the stock, interest and penalty. Let the complainant choose his satisfaction.
This whole problem could be easily resolved. All Sitka needs to do a fund a gift certificate to Bass Pro for the cost of the stock, interest and penalty. Let the complainant choose his satisfaction.
Apparently, the perp is too busy posting about singer John Prine being sick to be bothered with such trivial matters.
This whole problem could be easily resolved. All Sitka needs to do a fund a gift certificate to Bass Pro for the cost of the stock, interest and penalty. Let the complainant choose his satisfaction.
Apparently, the perp is too busy posting about singer John Prine being sick to be bothered with such trivial matters.
This whole problem could be easily resolved. All Sitka needs to do a fund a gift certificate to Bass Pro for the cost of the stock, interest and penalty. Let the complainant choose his satisfaction.
Apparently, the perp is too busy posting about singer John Prine being sick to be bothered with such trivial matters.
I'm all for holding a grudge and grinding an axe as long as the perpetrator is breathing air. Sometimes beyond that.
Myself and several others were stolen from in an online deal probably 15 years or more ago. I continued to bring it up every couple years as the man was still in business and acting like it never happened. Because of this, when you searched for him online, posts about his theft came up on several sites. People have a right to know who they're dealing with and not get ripped off themselves. Many years later I believe he had a stroke and may even have died. Karma is a bitch. I won't mention his name here, but I still bring it up from time to time, just in case he's still with us. F-him.
I paid a 500 lb lardass LGS owner $300 and traded him two of my rifles up front to order me a new varmint rig.
That Fatass left and went to the SHOT SHOW, was gone longer, made an extended vacay out of it. Didn’t send in my order with his distributor. Ended up taking almost 6 weeks to get my rifle, in that time he sold my trade rifles.
I was ready to bash his fat face in.
So now when anyone says “hey we went to the shot show”, I think of them dropping all priorities and spending their customers’ deposits. and being a lazy, mayonnaise drinking fatfûck
I paid a 500 lb lardass LGS owner $300 and traded him two of my rifles up front to order me a new varmint rig.
That Fatass left and went to the SHOT SHOW, was gone longer, made an extended vacay out of it. Didn’t send in my order with his distributor. Ended up taking almost 6 weeks to get my rifle, in that time he sold my trade rifles.
I was ready to bash his fat face in.
So now when anyone says “hey we went to the shot show”, I think of them dropping all priorities and spending their customers’ deposits. and being a lazy, mayonnaise drinking fatfûck
Well, file a claim in small claims where you live, pay a process server in AK to have Art served. If all is as you say, I can’t see him having to appear instead of mailing your property back. Add the cost of the server to your claim.
I paid a 500 lb lardass LGS owner $300 and traded him two of my rifles up front to order me a new varmint rig.
That Fatass left and went to the SHOT SHOW, was gone longer, made an extended vacay out of it. Didn’t send in my order with his distributor. Ended up taking almost 6 weeks to get my rifle, in that time he sold my trade rifles.
I was ready to bash his fat face in.
So now when anyone says “hey we went to the shot show”, I think of them dropping all priorities and spending their customers’ deposits. and being a lazy, mayonnaise drinking fatfûck
That was nice. lmao!
I publicly apologize to Slumlord and Renegade for the semi-hard time I gave them when they landed here. They are both freaking awesome additions to this site which I love and worth about ten of the fooking pogues that Wabigoon bemoans having left about every other week.
I paid a 500 lb lardass LGS owner $300 and traded him two of my rifles up front to order me a new varmint rig.
That Fatass left and went to the SHOT SHOW, was gone longer, made an extended vacay out of it. Didn’t send in my order with his distributor. Ended up taking almost 6 weeks to get my rifle, in that time he sold my trade rifles.
I was ready to bash his fat face in.
So now when anyone says “hey we went to the shot show”, I think of them dropping all priorities and spending their customers’ deposits. and being a lazy, mayonnaise drinking fatfûck
That was nice. lmao!
I publicly apologize to Slumlord and Renegade for the semi-hard time I gave them when they landed here. They are both freaking awesome additions to this site which I love and worth about ten of the fooking pogues that Wabigoon bemoans having left about every other week.
You gotta admit they are a great comedy team. They also give good info on their experiences. Renny has me wanting an Ak now. 😉
I paid a 500 lb lardass LGS owner $300 and traded him two of my rifles up front to order me a new varmint rig.
That Fatass left and went to the SHOT SHOW, was gone longer, made an extended vacay out of it. Didn’t send in my order with his distributor. Ended up taking almost 6 weeks to get my rifle, in that time he sold my trade rifles.
I was ready to bash his fat face in.
So now when anyone says “hey we went to the shot show”, I think of them dropping all priorities and spending their customers’ deposits. and being a lazy, mayonnaise drinking fatfûck
That was nice. lmao!
I publicly apologize to Slumlord and Renegade for the semi-hard time I gave them when they landed here. They are both freaking awesome additions to this site which I love and worth about ten of the fooking pogues that Wabigoon bemoans having left about every other week.
You gotta admit they are a great comedy team. They also give good info on their experiences. Renny has me wanting an Ak now. 😉
I paid a 500 lb lardass LGS owner $300 and traded him two of my rifles up front to order me a new varmint rig.
That Fatass left and went to the SHOT SHOW, was gone longer, made an extended vacay out of it. Didn’t send in my order with his distributor. Ended up taking almost 6 weeks to get my rifle, in that time he sold my trade rifles.
I was ready to bash his fat face in.
So now when anyone says “hey we went to the shot show”, I think of them dropping all priorities and spending their customers’ deposits. and being a lazy, mayonnaise drinking fatfûck
That was nice. lmao!
I publicly apologize to Slumlord and Renegade for the semi-hard time I gave them when they landed here. They are both freaking awesome additions to this site which I love and worth about ten of the fooking pogues that Wabigoon bemoans having left about every other week.
You gotta admit they are a great comedy team. They also give good info on their experiences. Renny has me wanting an Ak now. 😉
Oh!!! Go look at the pic example of the Bulgarian Arsenal Circle 10 Makarov I put money down on today.
On the Elkslayer91 is a Russian bot thread.
Leave him a nugget also. He loves his campfire buds.
I was just here reading, and saw it. I dropped it. Wrote it off. I dont care anymore. Got a new stock carved up, and got it the way I wanted. I'm done. I wont post again.
I was just here reading, and saw it. I dropped it. Wrote it off. I dont care anymore. Got a new stock carved up, and got it the way I wanted. I'm done. I wont post again.
Well, file a claim in small claims where you live, pay a process server in AK to have Art served. If all is as you say, I can’t see him having to appear instead of mailing your property back. Add the cost of the server to your claim.
Some people (azxholes like me) will spend 5 times what they lost to some schitball like sitka deer to make sure said schitball gets dealt some pain.
Well, file a claim in small claims where you live, pay a process server in AK to have Art served. If all is as you say, I can’t see him having to appear instead of mailing your property back. Add the cost of the server to your claim.
Some people (azxholes like me) will spend 5 times what they lost to some schitball like sitka deer to make sure said schitball gets dealt some pain.
Well, file a claim in small claims where you live, pay a process server in AK to have Art served. If all is as you say, I can’t see him having to appear instead of mailing your property back. Add the cost of the server to your claim.
Some people (azxholes like me) will spend 5 times what they lost to some schitball like sitka deer to make sure said schitball gets dealt some pain.
This is almost as long as the Elkslayer91 Troll thread....
Someone have a Synopsis of this situation?
😎
If you wanna read it, do so. If not, you weren't around here then, so stay out of it.
Yeah, I'm an [bleep].
Actually you’re not, usually...But, don’t ever let us hear you bitch if you get screwed over on a purchase you made here.
Yeah, I’ve heard you cry like a woman before....I’m an azzhole too. 😎
You may be thinking about your boyfriend when he caught an STD from your ass and the cock doc had to burn it out.
With the limited amount of info from this thread I followed from the get-go, I think he should have either returned the stock or compensated Splattermatic, which you would have understood had you simply educated yourself by reading it.
This is almost as long as the Elkslayer91 Troll thread....
Someone have a Synopsis of this situation?
😎
If you wanna read it, do so. If not, you weren't around here then, so stay out of it.
Yeah, I'm an [bleep].
Actually you’re not, usually...But, don’t ever let us hear you bitch if you get screwed over on a purchase you made here.
Yeah, I’ve heard you cry like a woman before....I’m an azzhole too. 😎
You may be thinking about your boyfriend when he caught an STD from your ass and the cock doc had to burn it out.
With the limited amount of info from this thread I followed from the get-go, I think he should have either returned the stock or compensated Splattermatic, which you would have understood had you simply educated yourself by reading it.
See, now that wasn’t so hard for you to say...Thanks bro!
PS,
Watch your diabetes. I hear it makes getting hard difficult for a fat fûck like yourself.
This is almost as long as the Elkslayer91 Troll thread....
Someone have a Synopsis of this situation?
😎
If you wanna read it, do so. If not, you weren't around here then, so stay out of it.
Yeah, I'm an [bleep].
Actually you’re not, usually...But, don’t ever let us hear you bitch if you get screwed over on a purchase you made here.
Yeah, I’ve heard you cry like a woman before....I’m an azzhole too. 😎
You may be thinking about your boyfriend when he caught an STD from your ass and the cock doc had to burn it out.
With the limited amount of info from this thread I followed from the get-go, I think he should have either returned the stock or compensated Splattermatic, which you would have understood had you simply educated yourself by reading it.
See, now that wasn’t so hard for you to say...Thanks bro!
PS,
Watch your diabetes. I hear it makes getting hard difficult for a fat fûck like yourself.
😎
No problem. Say hi to your mom for me. I'll take your advice on the diabetes. Stay safe.
This is almost as long as the Elkslayer91 Troll thread....
Someone have a Synopsis of this situation?
😎
If you wanna read it, do so. If not, you weren't around here then, so stay out of it.
Yeah, I'm an [bleep].
Actually you’re not, usually...But, don’t ever let us hear you bitch if you get screwed over on a purchase you made here.
Yeah, I’ve heard you cry like a woman before....I’m an azzhole too. 😎
You may be thinking about your boyfriend when he caught an STD from your ass and the cock doc had to burn it out.
With the limited amount of info from this thread I followed from the get-go, I think he should have either returned the stock or compensated Splattermatic, which you would have understood had you simply educated yourself by reading it.
See, now that wasn’t so hard for you to say...Thanks bro!
PS,
Watch your diabetes. I hear it makes getting hard difficult for a fat fûck like yourself.
😎
No problem. Say hi to your mom for me. I'll take your advice on the diabetes. Stay safe.
Some of these guys were not here for the orginal f~cking so they would not know what a theiving f~cktard some of their fellow posters really are ! Now they do, just consider it a Public service announcement !
![[Linked Image]](http://spewf.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/21.jpg)
but Randy's was trancendentally awesome. Masterful.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.adclassix.com/images/56delmontecatsup.jpg)
![[Linked Image]](http://verydemotivational.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/demotivational-posters-the-egg.jpg)
![[Linked Image from i1.wp.com]](https://i1.wp.com/www.onegreenplanet.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/smell-bad-ludo.jpg)
![[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]](https://i.postimg.cc/TPJZMyKF/0-D90-A97-B-FFF8-40-D9-B84-E-0-BF6-F0-F9-E3-EC.gif)
![[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]](https://i.postimg.cc/wBM0KR7T/20200323_142713.jpg)
[/url] ![[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]](https://i.postimg.cc/3wq93rvj/20200323_142654.jpg)
![[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]](https://i.postimg.cc/KvHVtG4M/Stuffforsaleincl-Avalancheplusduckpics017.jpg)
![[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]](https://i.postimg.cc/HkPypNZH/Stuffforsaleincl-Avalancheplusduckpics020.jpg)
![[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]](https://i.postimg.cc/pLzGvcbG/DSCF0781.jpg)
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/UBd4Qbd.jpg)
![[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]](https://i.postimg.cc/K8t3S5kv/edna.jpg)
![[Linked Image from i125.photobucket.com]](https://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p51/k20350/IMG_20190313_192713_zpsy1w2qq5y.jpg)
![[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]](https://i.postimg.cc/Hk3gHLCP/Boxers-Gay-Guns-zps29b776f6.jpg)
![[Linked Image from mlpforums.com]](https://mlpforums.com/uploads/post_images/img-2600341-1-dafuq_owl_by_domoraptor-d50f7tz.jpg)
![[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]](https://i.pinimg.com/474x/0b/52/82/0b5282b73cb1d186ba862449b4dd2486.jpg)