Originally Posted by antelope_sniper
Headhunter, now you are changing topics. We were discussing evolution, and when you were unable to respond to Brents discussion regarding a specific species, or my examples of extreme change, you changed the subject from Evolution to Abiogenesis. You then switched from Abiogenesis to Cosmology.

If you wish to admit defeat on the subject of evolution, we can then move on to other subjects such as abiogenesis and cosmology.


All evolution can say, scientifically, is this is how we believe life descended from life.

Evolution as Science cannot say how life began nor whether or not the process of evolution was directed. And as soon as "evolution" attempts to dogmatize such things, it is no longer Science but is Metaphysics.'

And metaphysically speaking, the belief that the material world is all that exists is Philosophical Materialism.

In either case, that of Theistic origins and directed creation or Atheistic Materialism, both are based on faith/belief, nothing more. Both positions are, fundamentally speaking, a religion, a world-view. And, believe me, there are fundamentalists in both camps.


The dispute is irresolvable. To an outsider, the scientific materialist looks like a closed-minded fundamentalist dogmatically (even angrily) asserting the sole primacy and validity of his worldview and on a holy mission to destroy anyone who disagrees.

To a scientific materialist, all others seem like the dogmatists that have clung to old beliefs and inhibited the progress of mankind since time immemorial. Furthermore, scientists are something like psychopathic serial killers in their single-minded and obsessive need to seek out problems and solve them (and thank God for that).

When you are a hammer, everything looks like a nail, you know? And they don't take kindly to people telling them that some problems are immutable, unsolvable, non-rational mysteries. It is not only a personal insult but, since most scientists are staunch humanists, it is an insult and challenge issued to mankind from the depths of the universe itself; another defense thrown up as nature attempts to elude its master. Yes, there is something Luciferic in all this. And that's OK, too.

Last edited by Olaf; 06/06/13.