Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
Originally Posted by ltppowell
Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
Perhaps, but he's wrong in precisely how I stated that he was in this particular case. Fear isn't the standard for lethal force justification. It must be reasonable fear by an objective standard. Were that not the case, Barney Fife would be justified in shooting half the town of Mayberry.


Nice twist, but what is reasonable is determined by what the individual in fear believes. You are correct in a way, as fear is not the only justification of the use of deadly force. If a person has displayed the use of deadly force (which a knife represents) and it is reasonably believed (again...by the individual) that death or serious bodily injury to another will occur if the arrest is delayed, deadly force is justified.
No twist was intended. With all due respect, however, there is a distinction between what an individual officer fears and what fears are reasonable under the circumstances. One is a subjective matter, and has no bearing on justification, while the other is an objective matter on which hinges legal justification.


The Lt. is correct. You are not. The reasonableness standard applies to the individual involved. Was the individual's fear of death or SBI to himself or another reasonable in the situation the individual was facing, including any justifications or other extenuating circumstances? If so, then lethal force is justified. It hinges on the individual involved, because the extenuating circumstances can involve the individual and his/her physical characteristics, the physical/psychological characteristics of the other person, the surrounding or precedent circumstances of the encounter, and a host of other issues.

I understand that you might have studied this and are citing the close-end text book rationale. However, that's not the legal rationale when it actually comes to real cases and real situations.

There is far too little known or shown in that one video to guess at justification or other circumstances. If there is another video, I'd like to see it.


Originally Posted by Mannlicher
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.