Originally Posted by 1tnhunter
Seems to me over the last 10 years or so it been the trend. Guys hunting deer with 223's, elk with 243's ect.
What's your opinion are we using lighter calibers than in the past to hunt North American game with?


Since I got started in 1982, I've seen more elk wounded and lost after being shot with a .243 than possibly/probably all other cartridges combined. Granted that the sample size is fairly small, it has definitely affected how I feel about using small diameter cartridges for elk.

Stouter, heavy-for-caliber bullets alleviate my concerns somewhat but not entirely. I still think a .243 is a better elk gun in the hands of an experienced hunter with good shooting skills than a youngster new to the game. If I had a young person starting out I'd probably hand them my .257 Roberts stoked with 120g A-Frames at +P velocities or get them a .260 Remington, 7mm-08 or .308 Winchester. In long actions a .25-06 or .270 Winchester would be my choice.

For myself, I started out with a 7mm RM and was fat, dumb and happy for 20+ years. Once the kids were gone I started branching out - first to a Marlin lever in .375 Win, then another in .45-70. Then to bolt guns in .300WM, .30-06 and most recently a .338WM. They all work. This year I'll be using a .30-06 for no other reason than Dad gave me one and it remains a virgin.

Her job may have Daughter #1 moving back to Colorado later this year. She used my .257 Roberts to good effect on antelope last year and is hooked on hunting. If she comes back it is a near certainty that she'll want to hunt elk in 2015. If she wants to use the .257 Roberts with 120g A-Frames for elk I'm OK with that but would rather she choose one of my .30-06s stuffed with 150g AccuBonds.

There are lots of loads that will bring down elk. Any centerfire round will do so with proper placement, blah, blah, but there is a definite progression in effectivity given equally marginal placement and/or lengthening ranges. Bullet design plays a big part in terminal effectiveness as does retained velocity and mass. A .22 Hornet on its best day is not the equivalent of a .223 Rem with 62g Barnes TTSX. Nor can any .223 match a .257 Roberts with a 120g Partition. For a you-can-only-have-one-for-the-rest-of-your-life hunting scenario, I'd take a 7m-08, .270 Win, .280 Rem, 7mm RM, .30-06, or .300WM over any of them.

Some people claim hydraulic shock has no lasting effect but I disagree. Poke a hole in a prairie dog (or water jug or watermelon or whatever) with a .22LR, blow one to bits with a .22-250 and similar placement and then answer what made the difference given both bullets had the same initial diameter and mass. A few years back I set up a couple sawhorses, laid a strip of 3/8" plywood on top, lined up some water jugs and started to play. The first jug was lined up on a leading corner of the plywood. I took the first shot with my .45-70 hunting load (350g North Fork @ 2180fps). Not only did a bunch of jugs blow up, hydraulic pressure from the first jug blew a hole in the plywood the size of the jug's bottom. In addition, the downward force broke the sawhorse. Placement is primary but when things start to go south I want a bullet with enough retained velocity and energy and frontal area to cause a very large pressure wave - one that can accelerate flesh well beyond its limits of elasticity - resulting in a more massive permanent wound. No, that doesn't mean I'm only willing to use a .375 RUM but I don't want a .243 Win either.

Last edited by Coyote_Hunter; 03/29/14. Reason: 2180fps, not 2280fps

Coyote Hunter - NRA Patriot Life, NRA Whittington Center Life, GOA, DAD - and I VOTE!

No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

A good .30-06 is a 99% solution.