Originally Posted by Angus1895
First of all I would like to clarify " what is your intent"


As a DAT and a DVM. As in a Dumd Ass Tanker and a Doctor of Veterinary Medince I have a strange level of training. Often I will assume everyone on the campfire has had the same........my bad.

I took armor gunnery training as a true delight , and if could have spent more time shooting in a main battle tank I would have never became a Doctor of Veterinary a Medicine. I would have stayed in the Army.

When people call me out for not understanding ballistics, physics, physiology, or how to behave around aggressive large ruminants I find it interesting.

My intent is as Einstein said. " To truly understand something one must be able to explain it simply"

This is why I post.


It is not to gain ego or belittle other members.

As a Veterinarian I took an oath ........
1. Allieviate animal suffering
2. Conserve Livestock resources
3. Protect public safety

If any of my posts on this forum are contrary to these principles please point them out to me as I will truly be ashamed.

But you are truly correct in that there are dissimilarity between a tank turret and a lung field, thoracic cavity, or " rib cage" however you may want to define it. This is why I believe the principles of hydrodynamic kinetic energy allows a a 5 pound sabot round the ability to disable a 63 TON main battle tank, where the same principles will not work as well on an animal. This is also why in the M60 A3 battle tank I operated for the U.S. Army we were given several options of ordinance for the differing situations possible. But alas I am completely ignorant and un informed on ballistics. Thanks for all the education.

A. The thorax in especially a ruminant is compartmentalized, I have never been able to dissect it, but time and time agin I am told there is a mediastinum that separates the lungs so they can operate in the ruminat seperately ( as if one is compromised)

1. There also may be a separate fascia plane, and seperating the heart from the left lung field.
2. There are also bronchial tubes and a trachea in the lung field that can prior to colllapse, allow external air to enter the compromised tissue. Kind of like leaving a hatch open in the turret. This should buffer the hydrodynamic effect of the projectile.

B. The thorax, unlike the turret, without massive trauma, has the ability to seal its self. Ruminants are legend for the ability to clot bleeding.

So even though a perhaps 5 pound projectile can totally stop and disable a 63 TON main battle tank does not mean the technology and physics behind the ordinance will work as well on dangerous game.

On reflection it is a lot easier killing a ruminant, compared to trying to keep it alive. However unless you got a good heeler dog, u better not be the slowest human out in the pen when they charge.

As things get tighter and tighter in the confrontations with dangerous large animals the considerations of elegant harvest as opposed to time to elude or escape change. The same goes with armor warfare. But like I say to Discuss armor warfare or my pointed out complete ignorance of ballistics or animal physiology with those who know so much of such things is perhaps contrary to the security of the country.

Perhaps I am out of line...........oh well I am sure I will hear about it soon.

Still pondering if I should get a Ruger number one. Then my 45 70 s can get cooked up another notch. ( as Emeril Lagassi would say).




Hang in there Angus,...it might get worse.

And though you are here with 2k+ posts and aren't exactly a newbie, I welcome you.