Originally Posted by antelope_sniper
Originally Posted by TF49
Originally Posted by antelope_sniper
Originally Posted by TF49
Originally Posted by antelope_sniper
Originally Posted by efw
Originally Posted by antelope_sniper


If this was true, there would be one religion held by all, and that's just not the case.


How does that, by necessity, follow from what I said?


One True God writing his True Message on the heart of every person would not lead to 4k different religions, nor religions that kill each other over their differences.




Well, let me offer up a view....


"Writing the Law of God on a heart" may not the same as writing the "True Message" on the heart of every person. Understanding ... and interpretation.... kinda depends on definitions.

The Law of God as I refer to here can be interpreted as knowing right from wrong.... having your "conscience" active in a person. We all know that we have done "wrong".... performed acts and spoken lies and spoken hate filled words...done wrongful "things".... done old fashioned sin...... I have done many....so have you and everybody else reading this post. We are all the same in that regard.

Writing the "Law" on a heart allows a person to judge right from wrong behavior.... and some times, right and wrong thought. The "Law" allows a person to recognize "sin."

"True Message" does have... or can have an important definition.... Not a bad term in my opinion... Anyway... the True Message can be delivered to a person's "heart." Action by the Holy Spirit if you will.... to show the person the truth about sinful behavior.... show the truth about God not being ok with sin.... and showing the truth about Jesus and forgiveness. A "True Message" indeed.

So, a man can have the "Law" written on his heart so he can see right and wrong... ie "sin".... then that man can have the "True Message" delivered to him.... right to his doorstep, so-to-speak..... BUT, here is where the rub comes in.

That man can reject the True Message ......because of his regard for his life, love of his lifestyle... or plain old pride in himself.


So, in this view... and I call it "view" as my understanding in many aspects of doctrine is incomplete.... the "view" holds that the True Message can be delivered and then rejected.... leaving the man in the same state he was before the message was delivered.

YMMV.....

TF



To me your "view" sounds like a post hoc rationalization for the fact that the observed behavior does not support the expected results of your hypothesis. We can quibble about what it means for an all knowing, all powerful, all kind being to " put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts" (Jeremiah 31:33), but if you want to go with law, the First Commandment in Exodus 20 is "Thou shalt have no other gods before me.", yet there are thousands of religions and less than a third of all people on earth are Christian, and most of those would fail to meet the campfire standard of "True Christian", so regardless of who you dress up your justification, the claim that your God wrote his law on the heart of every person fails to hold up under scrutiny.



Ok…. But can the “First Law” be “known” or even acknowledged by a man and then rejected?



Can it be written on your heart by the all knowing, all powerful, all kind creator of the universe in a way that it is "known to be true" and then rejected by most of the people on Earth?

That my friend is a hard no.



Well, I disagree. There have been many times in my life when I knew right from wrong and chose to do wrong. I was a “lawbreaker.” I have been “guilty” of breaking the “Law”. Before my salvation and after.

And further, here I am, a born again Christian believer, and yet I find myself going against God’s will…. Pretty much daily…..

The problem is fleshly desires…. Sinful habits that can will willing chosen by born again believers. You and I see that. I have never met a born again Christian that did not sin or have problems with obedience to God.

My view….yes…. The message can indeed be rejected.

Something can be known to be true and right, but man, can chose to yield to those powerful fleshly desires and therefore sin.

Good discussion though…. But I am hosting bbq today and gotta get after it…..later…

Last edited by TF49; 07/24/21.

The tax collector said: “Lord Jesus, have mercy on me, a sinner.” Jesus said he went home “justified.”