Originally Posted by Ackman
A bunch of people have really stupid ideas about this stuff. It's bad when any company goes under no matter who it is. The employees, the suppliers, people being supplied, everyone gets hurt. If one of the big 3 went down it would hurt the economy big time. Hundreds of thousands of people get their livelihood from GM. Terrible union agreements were strangling the company. And idiots are saying they won't buy GM because of govt. money? Some years back Chrysler was bailed out. Funny how some people love to brag on Ford not receiving any Govt. funding......they received plenty before the "bailout" and are still getting it, only under a different name. Do some checking, it's easy to find.




And this...

Originally Posted by MIVHNTR

It's obvious where your loyalties lie.
Again, some people just don't get it.


The pot calling the kettle black.


What a bunch of BS. Is this mr. goodwrench, aka the guy in Washington, D.C.? A government motors apologist trying to turn things to suit themselves.

You do some checking yourself. There's a big difference in paying off the unions and lying about paying the money back like gm did. gm still owes over $26 Billion and chrysler still owes over $2 billion. The taxpayer will never see a return on this government "investment".


From the NY Times. Tuesday Jan. 31, 2012:
"The Ford Motor Company, founded in 1903 by Henry Ford, is one of the largest auto makers in the world.

During a time of crisis throughout the auto industry in recent years, Ford emerged as the sole American automaker in a position to survive the steepest sales downturn in decades without a government bailout. That helped the company improve its reputation and win new customers.

Ford passed Toyota as the No. 2 seller in the United States in 2010."

"Ford�s current strength stems from what was a literal bet-the-company decision in 2006 to borrow $23.6 billion, putting even the company�s fabled blue logo up as collateral. That money helped Ford move more quickly than General Motors or Chrysler to bring out new lines of more fuel-efficient vehicles, and, more crucially, provided a cash cushion when the car market tanked along with the economy in late 2008. Ford also shifted its strategy to focus on its core brands and has sold off luxury brands, including Jaguar and Land Rover to the Tata Group of India for $2.3 billion in 2009. In March 2010, Ford reached an agreement to sell its Volvo subsidiary to a Chinese conglomerate."

Further, while Ford BORROWED money, it was all paid back. With interest. In the meantime gm and chrysler also borrowed money AND took bailout cash. We all know how that repayment went.

Another research article.
"Fellow Ford spokeswoman Christin Baker this week pointed out that Ford reported its participation in the CPFF in its public SEC filings. She also said Ford participated in the Federal Reserve's Term Asset-Backed Security Loan Facility, noting that "these two programs addressed systematic failure in the credit markets, and that neither program was designed for a particular company, or even a particular industry.

"Ford was a fractional participant in both of these credit programs, and the federal government made healthy returns on all of these limited transactions."

Bottom line? Yes, Ford's credit arm participated in a federal program meant to free up short-term lending at a time when very few investors were spending. It's no secret."

From a bit more research and a different resource.
"automotive lending companies got the most help, and leading the way was Ford Credit, which borrowed $15.9 billion. GMAC, GM�s financing arm which provided auto loans beyond the GM family of vehicles, took $13.9 billion. BMW took $6.2 billion. Chrysler $4.9 billion and Toyota $4.6 billion.

The GM and Chrysler loans were completely separate from those two companies� government-financed bankruptcies. We realize the two transactions are quite different, and this loan was not a bailout. All of this aid (Ford Motor Company) has since been repaid with interest to the government."


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