Originally Posted by DocRocket
Originally Posted by curdog4570

This thread was inspired by "Empire of the Summer Moon" and as I've said earlier,the guy should have got his ass out of the libraries and onto the ground and he wouldn't have written so much "revisionist and regurgitated bullshit".



I always get a laugh when I read someone claim an author has "regurgitated" his work. What does that mean, exactly? That the author developed his book on a foundation of others' writings, I suppose? If so, how is this "regurgitation"? How is this different than any other scholarly historical work ever written?

It's been my experience that most of the people who write things like "revisionist and regurgitated bullshit" have little or no experience in historical research, and have written even less.

I have really enjoyed this thread because a lot of folks, most notably Birdwatcher, have dug up some really good sources for us all to read that give a different perspective. Moreover, Birdy has put forth arguments that have built a logical and consistent alternative position that I find very compelling. You may note that Birdwatcher has quoted, or as some might say, "regurgitated", many lengthy passages from others' writings.

Guinn's book, whether you like it or not, was a very readable and very popular book that opened a lot of people's eyes to Texas and plains Indian history. If you have read Guinn's book, and particularly his afterword, you'll know that he did indeed spend a lot of time outside of libraries, exploring Texas historical sites and travelling the roads and byways to get a sense of the geography about which he was writing. Inspired by his experience and his book (and by some of Birdwatcher's travelogues and photos of 150-year-old battle sites in the present day) I have made a point over the past year of getting into my car or onto my motorcycle and visiting these same places, so that I can get a better grasp of the history, to take it out of the books and into my larger mind, as it were. But to accuse Guinn of being a bookworm in a library suggests you haven't read his book, or if you did, you only read it to confirm a preconceived prejudice against him and his views.

I started this thread because I was one of those people who was intrigued and even inspired by "Empire of the Summer Moon". Since then I've read a lot more about that period, and while I may not hold to some of Guinn's versions of the history here and there, I think the book he wrote was a valid historical perspective and as such worthy of my respect. Whether you care to respect it is entirely your business, of course.


Of course I read the book.I pointed out some of the glaring geographical errors he made.Even a glance at a map would have prevented a lot of them.I picture a guy reading historical accounts and adding a little "local color" without ever actually visiting the locales.

I could,for instance,write a story about fishing in Big Lake Tx.If I wrote about the types of fish in the "big lake",most folks wouldn't know enough to brand me a phony.

If I wrote that the fishing is done at Pandale , on the Pecos,rather than in a "Big Lake",it might establish my credibility with folks familiar with Big Lake.

Mike seems hellbent on downgrading the reputation of the Comanches as warriors,and building up the eastern tribes.That's his business,but his agenda detracts from his writing talent,which is formidable.


Never holler whoa or look back in a tight place