Originally Posted by MarineHawk
Originally Posted by 458Win
Originally Posted by moosemike

I don't know who is saying a .30-06 won't work? a 220 grain bullet at or near 2,500 fps is pretty formidable. Still, some folks might desire more range.


Oh great, now we can start a minimum caliber at 100 yards and a minimum caliber at 200/300/400 yard thread.

This entire "minimum caliber" idea is a matter of personal opinion. If you are hiring a guide and he, or she ( may daughter just got her full registered guide's license), says xyz is their minimum caliber then you can be assured that they have a reason.

I can tell you from my 35 years of guiding experience that any rifle in the realm of a .270/7mm/308/30-06 with today's bullets and a competent shooter will successfully kill any bear in Alaska, at any distance from the muzzle to 300 yards.

If one can place a larger or faster bullet in the same place it might drop them a fraction of a second quicker, but it won't kill them any deader.


Sure, but the disparagement of Mike�s comment as "clueless" simply for saying �some folks might desire more range� is unfair for a couple of reasons. I don�t know exactly what he meant, but it applies to my upcoming hunt, because I�m hunting brown bear, moose, wolf, and wolverine (and possibly black bear when we get below tree-line). Where I�m hunting, my guide�s clients have taken wolves out to 350yds and a little beyond.

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I�d like to keep that option open.

I don�t know for sure what might be capable with handloads and other specific bullets with the 30-06 220gr loading, but the factory loadings I can find have the 30-60 220gr loads dropping 25� below the sight line at 350 yds. My .340 puts the .225gr TTSX at a little less than 3� high at 150yds, and a little more than 6� low at 350yds (actual range results). Now someone who is really trained well with the 30-06 220gr can do it fine I�m sure, but it�s easier for me to learn to shoot a .340 at that range than it is to shoot a 30-06 220gr at the same range. So, a flatter-shooting rifle, of whatever caliber, might be more versatile for multiple game. Either option is fine, but neither is �clueless,� and worthy of disparaging insults.

Also, to the extent that the versatility of a multi-game rife is not allowed on this thread, although I doubt I would shoot at a brown bear much past about 200 yds, but maybe I would under great conditions on the last day of a hunt, and you mentioned �at any distance from the muzzle to 300 yards�: At least with the factory loadings I can find (e.g, http://www.federalpremium.com/products/details/rifle.aspx?id=19), a 220gr 30-06 bullet is moving at around 1,620fps at 300 yds. Is that good? I�m asking because I don�t know. But a .225gr .338 bullet out of a .340 moving at 2,600 fps at 300 yds might be a bit preferable. At 200 yds even, the 30-06 220gr is moving at only around 1,860 fps, and the 225gr .340 is moving at around 2,780 fps. Perhaps they both might work similarly, I don�t know, but hitting a big bear at rifle-velocity with a .338-cal bullet instead of hitting it with a fast-handgun velocity with a .30-cal bullet, even if not always necessary, can�t be clueless. It's close to the difference between hitting the bear near the muzzle with a 30-30 versus a 30-06. Maybe both would work, but it's not "clueless" to prefer a 30-06 over a 30-30 for close range work. Same difference.

Comments in response to a reasonable opinion like �some folks might desire more range� such as �Is there anything else you want to do to prove just how clueless you are? � Please, the above questions are purely rhetorical and your guesses are truly not being sought!� is just unnecessary and nasty for no reason. No one on here who advocates for a bigger gun is calling anyone who opts for a smaller one �clueless.� They�re just reasonable opinions to discuss. That�s what a forum like this is for I think.


For the reasons already addressed Moosemike is clueless... but let's look at what you are doing... You want to saddle the 30-06 with 220gr bullets even though you think you want to stretch things out.

The perfectly adequate 180gr bullet weight is far closer to the right bullet in the 30-06 and is certainly not right at the upper edge of available bullets. Apples to oranges.

Of course if you were to learn to reload it would make all sorts of things easier. Some guides do not like reloads on hunts but they work just fine and if you really study it you should be able to learn how. I work out three times a day just to stay in shape so I can reload. It may not be easy but I think most people should be able to handle it with practice and working out. And pulling the lever on the reloading press is a really good motion for improving flexibility in your shoulder so you can reach around and pat yourself on the back again. And reloading really isn't that hard, anyone that really puts their mind to it should be able to handle the effort. And you can even load different bullet weights and get different energies out of different loads and everyone knows Energy is where it's at if you train for it and work really hard, most anyone can do it.


Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.