Further, the Holy Spirit.....".... lives with you (us) and will be IN you. So, when a Christian says "I have proof." He really does... the Spirit of Truth is living in that born again Christian.
All other religions claim the same “proof” – you sure you haven’t been fooled by Satan? It sounds like the sort thing that he would convince you of.
Originally Posted by TF49
Accept or reject....Choose wisely.....
Serious consideration would require evidence. Faith choices are made without demonstrable evidence and sounds more like a gambling issue.
Oh?, but faith is made of demonstrable evidence as in textual studies, to show that we have trustworthy versions of the original biblical documents....historical studies, to show that there is considerable demonstrable truth in the Gospels.....biblical studies, to demonstrate the remarkable consistency the Bible demonstrates from beginning to end.... the use of philosophical arguments to show that there is a reasonably high probability that God exists.....then there is the non-eternality of the physical universe....the unique nature of humans, including rationality, consciousness, moral responsibility.... fine-tuning of the universe to permit chemical complexity, and thereby life itself....the existential conflict of humans: our awareness of falling short of something better....
so yes, I consider the above as EVIDENCE.....but, and this is a big but, there is no actual PROOF....that is why Christians and others have the BELIEF....gambling issue (Pasqual's Wager), yes, that is what started me off in believing (decades ago) as the stakes would just too high for me not to believe... like I said before, I am choosing to believe because the fifty-fifty odds are just too great for me to wager...so I will continue to pray, ask for forgiveness, and always do the right thing.... But I don't believe that it can stop there. I must become mature in my faith and have definitive reasons for it that are based on the truth and not just pragmatism, because as stated before, God can see what is truly in the heart.
The bible is factually and historically wrong, written over centuries past the alledged events and by some unknown authors. And there is zero evidence to support the fantastic events written down in it. Don't even start to talk about the inconsistencies and contradictions, and lack of clarity. What is it, 200 denominations of Christians reading from the same book?
The bible is evidence than many people wrote a book. Harry Potter has at least a known author.
You still cling to the totally flawed Pascal's Wager - it could be argued to show that the atheist is going to be better off, but gambling taken seriously is prety stupid anyway.
Well, my friend, I wrote of evidence and not of proof...that is my story...you may choose as you believe..i like the biblical evidence....
Fair enough, but some people prefer demonstrated truth over what they would like to be true.
Originally Posted by Raspy
...the Wager is not flawed from my perspective...either there is or either there is not an afterlife.
You only factor in one god except there are thousands of gods to choose from - not good odds from the get go. Many are jealous gods and will be upset if you choose a false god.
Wrong, re-read way above....I said "that is why Christians and others have the BELIEF..."
Like I said, there are thousands of gods, and not all will condemn you to hellfire. Even Jesus didn't preach of a hell.
To me there is only one God(of the Bible) and that is my belief...if I am wrong then I am fu*ked.....atheist believe in no God and if you are wrong then you are fu*ked...if we are both wrong, then I guess we are both un-fu*ked.....who knows what hell is actually like....some people believe it is hellfire, some believe it is a perpetual sadness, a loneliness...like I said I am hanging on to what I believe...
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