Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by TF49
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by RayF
Colossians 2:8: "Be careful that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deceit based on human tradition, based on the elements of the world, rather than Christ."


St Paul copied from Greek philosophy during his stay in Greece, some of his words are taken nearly word for word from Greek philosophy.



Well, don’t leave us hanging. Pls post where Paul quoted from Greek sources. BUT, would you pls show the context? Tell us what this borrowed “philosophy” was.

I am afraid some reader might think that Paul got some of his Christian philosophy Greek writers.

Clearly, he did not, and it would be good of you to show that.




I've posted it before. It's typically dismissed or ignored. Yet it is undeniable;



Quote:
''One thing that many people do not know about the New Testament is that it actually contains several direct quotes from certain ancient Greek writers. In fact, there are a total of at least five quotes from four different Greek writers found throughout the pages of the New Testament. The following is a list of all of all the known quotations.''

The verses are given in full with the quotations written in bold:


#1 and #2. Acts 17:27-28: “That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us: For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.“

This verse actually contains two quotations. The first quotation comes from The Kretika by the Greek poet and mystic Epimenides of Knossos. The second quotation comes from line five of the didactic poem Phainomena by the Stoic philosopher Aratos of Soloi.

#3. Acts 26:14: “And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.”

This unusual phrase is a direct quote from line 1624 of the Greek tragedy Agamemnon by Aischylos.

#4. 1 Corinthians 15:33: “Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners.”

This saying is directly quoted from the comedy Thais by the Athenian comic playwright Menandros. Menandros, however, seems to have actually gotten the quote from the tragedy Aiolos by Euripides.
The apostle Paul seems to have enjoyed, or at least had extensive knowledge of, classical drama, judging by the fact that he quotes from at least two different classical playwrights.


#5. Titus 1:12: “One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, The Cretians are alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies.”

This quote comes from the Kretan poet Epimenides of Knossos. This quote, like the one found in Acts 17:28, comes from The Kretika. In fact, it seems to come from the exact same passage. Epimenides is not mentioned by name in either of the places where he is quoted and The Kretika has, sadly, not survived. The only reason we know that these passages are quoted from him is because ancient commentators who had access to Epimenides’s writings made note of this fact.

Based on these two quotations, we can reconstruct the passage as a refutation of the widely held Kretan belief that Zeus was a mortal king of Krete and that he died there and was buried. This belief is also referenced by the early mythographer Euhemeros (whom you may remember from my previous article “The Original Myth-Busters”).

The authors of the New Testament must have either really admired Epimenides or at least seen him as a useful figure to establish good relations with the pagans because he is quoted, not once, but twice in the New Testament, and in different books no less, making him the most quoted non-Jewish writer in the entire Bible. It is also interesting that this passage directly refers to Epimenides as a “prophet,” which makes him one of a small handful of non-Jewish persons to be explicitly referred to as a prophet.

In addition to these five direct quotes, there are also passages, particularly in Paul’s letters, where Christian teachings are explained using concepts from Greek philosophy. For instance, Paul’s famous description of the body having many parts with different functions in 1 Corinthians 12 may have been partly inspired by a similar image conjured up in Platon’s Protagoras 349c, in which Sokrates uses the example of how the different parts of the face all perform very different functions from each other and from the function of the whole and yet, through the combination of all the different parts working together in harmony, they each contribute to the function of the whole.''


So again, If St Paul copied from Greek philosophy, he was not using his own thoughts or reasoning, or being inspired by God, he was copying other people's work, the work of Greek Philosophers.



Ok, this will end up long and boring but some may trudge through it.

The applicable term I’ve seen used for this is issue is “riffing on the audience.” Preachers today use it quite a bit. A pastor may start a sermon by trying to establish a connection with an audience or pique interest by quoting current day football coach about what he said is required to win or build a strong team. He might then launch into how the the coach’s words could be useful in a personal life or church setting.

For,example, Corinth was a trading center with a great variety of peoples and many backgrounds. Many might read the letter would immediately recognize the quotes from the Greek writers. As a modern day preacher might do, Paul was likely trying to “grab the reader’s attention” for the purpose of presenting a follow on point.

The article you so artfully cut and pasted avoids this explanation.

In fact, the article finishes by falsely claiming ....”if St. Paul copied from Greek philosophy, he was not using his own thoughts or reasoning....,he was copying other people’s work.” This is a dishonest and misleading conclusion. Lousy research and biased literary analysis.

I will post this and then later, after church come home and beat this to death.

Paul was “riffing” to make a point of connection with audience and clearly did not “borrow” to make NT philosophy.

Btw....use the idea of “riffing” to grab someone’s attention is very common.

Last edited by TF49; 06/21/20.
The tax collector said: “Lord Jesus, have mercy on me, a sinner.” Jesus said he went home “justified.”