Originally Posted by JoeBob
Originally Posted by antelope_sniper
Originally Posted by JoeBob
Originally Posted by MtnBoomer
Originally Posted by JoeBob


Well, Einstein, since you are such a stickler for terminology you should probably figure out that you’ve given the definition for micro evolution, which no one denies, instead of evolution.

Yah, please explain your thoughts on mutations again. LOL


When you are talking about new information that you would need to get from ancient simple life, you need new proteins to form new genes. The chances of one mutation in one protein fold is 10 to the 77th power. Now, there are many folds in a protein and many proteins in a gene. But then, assuming you get that, and you get altered DNA, DNA alone does not control the laying out of the body plan, the morphological plan. You could mutate DNA until the cows some home and it doesn’t change the plan. There are other factors at work. The life forms in that early Cambrian era had on average 50 cells with all the genes and proteins therein.

Darwinian evolution is not adequate to explain this jump from simple life forms with simple plans to new body parts laid out in new ways with new functions. That requires new information. Where did it come from? There are only about 10 to the 78th power particles in the entire universe and the odds of a viable mutation in a single protein fold is 10 to the 77th. The math is insurmountable.

I have thoughts on what happened, but I’m not going to make any claims. But I think it is pretty apparent that something happened or there is some mechanism that we do not understand as the math makes that jump pretty improbable.



You are so clueless.

To begin with, every human is natuarally born with mutations, on average somewhere between 50 to 100 alleles in a babe are different from either parent. We also see the same thing in "identical" twins. In really there will be about a 100 allele difference between the "identical" twins. Now extend the accumulation of those differences across a population, and across an extended period of time and the changes add up quickly.



But I wasn’t talking about humans. I was talking about the mutations that caused a fifty cell organism to develop an eye when nothing like that structure existed.

I am literally NOT arguing for the existence of God in this thread. I’m not even denying micro evolution. And maybe, I’m not even arguing a bit more than micro evolution in higher order animals. But to get from those simple animals to the higher ones, you need new information and the math makes the insertion of that information by random mutation unlikely. The earth simply isn’t old enough even if it is 4.5 billion years old. There haven’t been enough organisms.



Ok.

Let's do some math.

Let's take something like e.coli. It has 4 million base pairs and divides every 20 minutes. That's 72 generations in a day, each doubling in size. The last generation alone will have 4,700,000,000,000,000,000,000 bacteria

Now e.coli mutates at a rate of 1 mutation per 1000 replication, so there's still 4,700,000,000,000,000,000 mutations present in just the last generation from that one bacteria in one day.

Now that number is just 2^72

So, lets take 4.5 billion years, times 365 days, times 72 generations per day.....that's 1.1826e+14

Now lets start with one bacteria and divide it and it's successive generations that many times.
When I plug it into my statistic program RStudio, it returns.........Infinity........

So mathematically, yea.....there's plenty of time for it all to happen.


You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.

You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell